Would just like to share my recent thoughts on the idea of ‘crying wolf’. As we all know, the original story goes that the boy kept crying wolf when there was no wolf, eventually people stopped answering his cries, and when a real wolf turned up no-one came and it ate him.
But what if it was different? What if what really happened was this: There WAS a wolf, the boy cries out, and all the people come running. The wolf runs off, scared of all the commotion. Relieved to have company in the dark night, and frightened of the wolf returning, the boy is very upset when they all leave again.
Later the wolf returns, and again the boy cries out. The same thing happens. Each time the wolf returns, he cries out for help, the people come, and the wolf runs away when it sees them coming. Eventually, they ignore the boys cries as they don’t believe this IS a wolf.
I dunno. That's how I find it anyway.
"I have a room for life at the home for the chronically groovy!" - Sgt Floyd Pepper
I imagine this happens quite commonly, in respect to mental illnesses and thoughts of suicide or things like that. Would you like to talk about what is going on for you right now? Have you had your own experience like this?
See I don't think that would be "crying wolf". In terms of suicide, I really don't think someone who feels suicidal and then says so and is helped by people responding is "crying wolf". I think they might need to look at different coping skills and finding out why they are suicidal because they have to consider that being openly suicidal is very stressful for others. But I don't think it's faking it like "crying wolf" would suggest. I really think that phrase really only would be applicable to someone who was claiming suicide to manipulate others, not for someone who is really feeling suicidal. I think though that people say that simply because it is so stressful when a loved one talks about suicide repeatedly and they don't know how to deal with it.
If you're feeling like this is the case for you, could you think about ways to deal with feeling suicidal? As in why are you turning to suicide so often? What are some other options since suicide isn't what your really want when you see people who care for you? Maybe realize that when people get frustrated and claim it's "crying wolf", it's just that they care about you and are scared and don't know how to deal with it. The thing is people just can't cope with someone being suicidal forever, even if you are serious and feel helped by them. So it's a much better idea to find a better way of dealing with distressing situations while still getting support so you never get to the stage of considering suicide in the first place.
Stereotypes are the epitome of human laziness.
- me
If the boy is out alone in the dark and repeatedly sees a wolf that may attack him then wouldn't it be wise for him to learn from his repeated experiences and learn how to protect himself with a sword or fire or whatever else stops wild animals attacking? I mean if there was a real wolf then wouldn't he want to find out a way to protect himself as best he can? Wouldn't that make more sense than to repeatedly cry out for help and simply hope for a response that may or may not come for whatever reason...
@cagedbird
well of course he'd want to learn to fight off the wolf or whatever. But how would he go about learning how to? Really he'd need someone to teach him.
I've got no-one to teach me, dropped by services, no help at all, tried every avenue. Its been so long i can't remember a time before i was ever suicidal, before this huge pain inside... they wont help me.
as for finding coping mechanisms - im coping, or rather alive.
i dont want to 'cope' i want to get better.
they took the last hope
"I have a room for life at the home for the chronically groovy!" - Sgt Floyd Pepper
It's unfortunate you don't have services. Is there anything you can do to fix that? But you can also teach yourself as well. Think about what has worked and also what hasn't. Learn from it because you want to get better. How can you deal with stressful situations aside from suicide, which will only make it more stressful? Think of things you like to do or that help you feel better that are also positive. If you learn to do that, things slowly will get better. But you first have to make a decision that suicide is not the answer to life's problems. And then work your way, albeit slowly, from there. This site as well as the rest of the internet is a great resource for ideas. And hopefully there is a way for you to get services back, but until then, you can take control of it yourself as much as possible to begin getting better.
You may not having to use coping skills in the far future, but feeling suicidal is not going to go away over night when you've felt that way for so long. You are going to have a lot of distressful feelings/thoughts that you have to deal with before it goes away. Not to mention life is distressing for the most healthy person at times anyway. Nothing will ever be perfect, but you can find ways to deal with things without becoming so desperate as to consider suicide. And things will slowly be less hard to handle as you practice healthy methods of dealing with them. You'll automatically use coping skills without even knowing it, so that things won't feel nearly as bad in the first place.
Stereotypes are the epitome of human laziness.
- me
The thing is, my life is one big coping mechanism. What I mean is that I have always tried to find (healthy) ways to cope with the pain I feel inside and to make my life better, things like persuing jobs and desire to travel, spending time with friends and making a 'home' for myself. I have been doing this, making decisions in my life carefully considering all options, to make sure I do the best thing and can cope and hopefully be happier, since I was 12 or so (I'm now nearly 27). Obviously I didn't know there was anything wrong with me as such back then, I guess I just felt I was 'bad' or deficient in some way and just kept trying to cope whilst things inside got worse and worse.
I need help. I know all the 'coping' stuff but I want to get better, to be able to hold down a job and stuff (I have been employed only about 2.5 yrs in total, ever, didn't go to uni, place to do nurse training withdrawn due to mh probs and criminal record **it was the mh problems and all the vicious and untrue stuff written by the mh people that did it**) I experienced hell at the hands of professionals when I was younger (have nightmares about it now), and now in a different area I find the dismissive, stigmatising attitude is there again.
Things don't just get magically better when you have many years of hurt and trauma inside you; I need therapy.
As for being suicidal; I'm not just randomly and regularly suicidal, I have only been at very bad times of my life (abusive bf, homeless etc) and recently as I feel there are really no other options left.
For the record, things are now so bad I stay in bed a lot/most of the time despite putting in so much effort to try to be ok, I struggle to do the most basic things, I feel exhausted all the time and phsically heavy and just want the world to disappear. I also, apparently, have night terrors during which I cry and wander around confused, and hit myself on the head; as well as nightmares that I remember.
I'm sorry I don't mean to criticise your reply, it's just I feel at a total dead end now. I need help and can't get it. I can't do this alone; I tried and ended up having to ask for help.
Last edited by earthbound_misfit : 30-05-2012 at 03:27 AM.
Reason: info
"I have a room for life at the home for the chronically groovy!" - Sgt Floyd Pepper
I feel for you, things are obviously very hard for you at the moment.
I read your other post about being called an attention seeker, that is a horrid thing for a professional to say and I would be hurt too. Have you asked them to explain to you how asking for help is attention seeking? I'd be interested to know what behaviours or random illogical perspectives they are basing that on!
I'm sure you have, but have you asked explicitly for therapy? What treatment, if any, have you been offered in the past? Are you on any medication for the depression? Could you speak to you GP about your concerns rather than keep engaging with the crisis team who are not helpful and are even detrimental to your health?
It sounds at the moment you need help to stabilise your low mood. I hope you go to your GP for help, perhaps if you are on meds the dose needs to be changed? Also, and I really get how hard this next bit will be - but staying in bed will not be helping your mood so perhaps you need to get into a routine of getting up and going for a walk every morning or something? As I said, I know this isn't a 'cure' and may seem impossible but if you can help yourself just one more time to lift your mood then you may feel more able to find therapy etc.
I can understand that you don't want to simply cope through life anymore and want to be productive and be able to hold down a job etc. I think it is good you are asking for help, it just sounds to me like you need to find some different people to listen!
I do try to get up everyday, I said that. I put in 100% effort all the time, every day, for so little. I'm not just lying in bed lazily; im physically feeling really heavy, anxious, frightened, and really broken like I could be sick with the pain inside. I have been getting staedily worse with depression for the last 5 months or so; and reapeatedly ignored. My gp keeps referring me to the CMHT and they ignore the referals, saying they cant help me and im just attention seeking. I am desperate. All I can think is of getting together pills and killing myself. I am trying to do the right thing for my boyfriend but I need help and there isnt any so i dont really have theat choice. the gp has no appointments and wont even call me back to say whats happening; instead the nasty gp at the sugery called to be abusive and dismissive of me. They just keep saying im attention seeking because i am asking for help, i dont know what im supposed to do. i have tried again and again to be fine without them but it doesnt work. this is the illest i have ever been and ive got to die, im just beign a coward
"I have a room for life at the home for the chronically groovy!" - Sgt Floyd Pepper
its so bad i can barely ever leve the house, its not that im not trying, i am, so hard. i had really bad social anxiety and ocd when i was younger and never told anyone, so i know how to put lots of willpower in, its just things ARE REALLY BAD
"I have a room for life at the home for the chronically groovy!" - Sgt Floyd Pepper
I don't know how CMT works, but can't you call them yourself, to explain the situation ?
Do you know what started their feeling of you just being attention-seeking ? I'm not saying it's your fault, but there's certainly a reason why they act like that. Did they always act like that, or did it start at a certain point ?
-- English is not my mother-tongue, so I apologize for any spelling/grammar mistake --
I have tried explaining to them, and so has my boyfriend, but they just label any attempt to get help as 'attention-seeking', if I contact PALS (patient advice and liaision service) or anyone else it's seen as 'manipulative' and even PALS have picked up on their hatred of me and are being useless and unsympathetic. Everyone just sends me to someone else. Apparently I've been referred now to 'support services' which is things to help you day-to-day and encourage you to do things like uni, go back to work, etc. This sounds great as support, but they are ignoring the elephant in the room of my depression and awful feelings inside that mess with my sleep and worsen the depression, which is the reason I struggle so much day to day. It's not support I need - my boyfriend is really supportive, as are some friends - it's actual treatment I am lacking. My life is not unstable, I am housed, have friends, etc. I just can't seem to get much done or move towards work or anything with these awful feelings and exhausted lethargy all the time.
It's a bit like having a badly broken leg and being offered someone to help do the shopping and stuff, but no-one to set the leg and put it in plaster so I can do that stuff myself! I just want to get better, and I have learnt through bitter experience that doesn't happen magically over time, but will require in-depth therapy. I have done as much as is possible on my own.
I'm not sure when I was first labelled attention seeking, it'll go with the BPD misdiagnosis (and it IS a misdiagnosis; when they tested me properly with the questionnaires and stuff I didn't have it, but it's impossible to remove from records).
I first went to the doctors with depression aged 17, but it wasn't until I was 19 I seriously tried to get help. (I moved away from my parents at 18 and had thought I'd be happy away from that situation).
I thought mental health services would be helpful and understanding, and was shocked at the way I was treated. Anyone with a BPD diagnosis was ignored, and they seemed to slap the diagnosis on an awful lot of people without properly assessing them.
Anyway since then I have tried twice to get help (I now live in a different area) but the judgements and layers of lies built upon misconceptions are all over my notes, so no-one will help, they just see 'incurable person' rather than 'person repeatedly denied help'
Last edited by earthbound_misfit : 30-05-2012 at 06:14 PM.
Reason: sp
"I have a room for life at the home for the chronically groovy!" - Sgt Floyd Pepper
I'm sorry that you feel people aren't taking you seriously; sadly that can go hand-in-hand with a BPD diagnosis, as some people can feel that things are related to the BPD (misdiagnosis or not). Do you mind if I ask, who diagnosed the BPD? It might help to ask to see a PD specialist for assessment if you haven't already; that way, if you do get the same diagnosis, you can be sure, and if not, things will be clearer. Diagnoses aren't impossible to remove; people are misdiagnosed all the time (or things are 'upgraded', ie. depression to bipolar, etc.) so change can happen.
I think I mentioned this somewhere else, and I can't remember what you said, but what would help? Many places offer counselling (such as uni's) if you'd like that.
I don't think they ever see anyone as incurable; though I do understand what you mean. I would say though, if there's a course of treatment that you want, ask, because they will often go along with it.
It doesn't matter where you come from; it matters where you go.
No-one gets remembered for the things they didn't do.
We won't all be here this time next year,
so while you can take a picture of us.
We're definitely going to hell,
but we'll have all the best stories to tell.
I'd like therapy, and they've basically said I can't have it. Sounds like you live in an area where they're a lot nicer than others - here if you suggest a course of treatment you get labelled manipulative/attention-seeking and are reminded you are not the dr.
I'm terrified and very, very alone right now.
Sorry.
"I have a room for life at the home for the chronically groovy!" - Sgt Floyd Pepper
Yes, I live in London, and MH services are (in my opinion) better here; at least compared to where I grew up and you essentially have to 'deal with it' unless you're suicidal/homicidal/psychotic.
Do you see a GP? It might help to get their support. If you feel like therapy would help, it seems incredibly cruel to deny it from you, and I don't understand why a BPD diagnosis would mean they could not allow it.
It doesn't matter where you come from; it matters where you go.
No-one gets remembered for the things they didn't do.
We won't all be here this time next year,
so while you can take a picture of us.
We're definitely going to hell,
but we'll have all the best stories to tell.
There are lot of worse diagnoses to have (though let's not start a competition! :P) but it can be quite difficult for people with BPD to be taken 'seriously'. I know of people who, rightly or wrongly, have a BPD diagnosis, and they can be really, really unwell, and still be turned away from MH services.
Anyway.
It doesn't matter where you come from; it matters where you go.
No-one gets remembered for the things they didn't do.
We won't all be here this time next year,
so while you can take a picture of us.
We're definitely going to hell,
but we'll have all the best stories to tell.
When I got diagnosed with bpd I got much more help offefered to me then when i was just diagnosed with depression. I tihnk the bpd diagnosis can get you help sometimes.
I didn't mean that it's a worse diagnosis in the sense of 'oh it's alright for you, you only have bipolar, whereas I have BPD'. I just meant that nobody seems to take it seriously here, which is true.
