What does being sectioned actually involve?

[Angel2fire]

For the last few weeks I've been at the stage where sometimes I think being in hospital would help. I've been given the option by my pyschiatrist and the crisis team but I don't want to go as I've been before and it was awful.

However, I appear to be getting worse. I'm scared that if I lose the plot completely and refuse to go in, they will section me.

I got sectioned for about 15 minutes! Last time I was in because I wanted to go for a cigarette and the nurse wouldnt let me go so I tried to anyway and she sectioned me but as soon as I saw the pyschiatrist he took it off.

I know that being sectioned means they can "make you stay somewhere" but what else does it involve? I've read on here somewhere that it can intefere with doing certain types of jobs e.t.c.

I'm hoping that if I do have to go in, I'll be of sound mind enough to agree to it, but if I'm not I just want to know how "bad" being sectioned really is.

Thanks for reading.

[whirlpools]

Sections can be carried out by two doctors and a social worker, or just an Approved Social Worker, or the shorter ones can be carried out by nurses or the police.

It means you will be detained in a place of safety - if the police section you they can take you to the police station or a special suite in a psychiatric hospital until further assessment. Nurses can detain you on the ward pending a doctor's assessment. Doctors and social workers can send you directly to the psychiatric ward.

They sign a pink paper saying you can be sectioned. It's frustrating being sectioned; there's a lot less freedom than being informal. I wouldn't recommend it as a course of action.

If you are aware you might be sectioned, I strongly recommend you go in voluntarily.

[Cedrus]

The whole section 17 leave scenario that happens when you're on a section is really annoying. Waiting around for your consultant to sign papers saying you are allowed out, nurses saying they have to check the section 17 before you leave, having to wait ages when your consultant has gone on leave themselves and then having to get back on time so the police aren't rung to bring you back. It made me really frustrated and caused a lot of tears the last time I was in hospital. Maybe you can come up with an agreement or something with the crisis team in case you get in too much of a bad place, tell them how you feel about hospital now and your concerns if things get worse. For me hospital felt so much worse when I wasn't allowed out, towards of the end of my admission I was given 10 hours leave daily and I found myself feeling much better that when the ward got too much I could just go out.

[Too Shy]

Being sectioned can interfere with some jobs, but it won't necessarily. It really depends on what section is used, and what the job is. I've been told by professionals that s.136s won't show up on enhanced CRBs, but there are lots of examples (from people on RYL too) of cases where they certainly have shown up. As far as I'm aware section 136s can show up on enhanced CRBs because of the police involvement (it's down to the discretion of the force involved), but medical sections are unlikely to show up. However, they will still show up on medical records, which may have an impact for certain jobs where occupational health checks are carried out, and it might be that you have to be 'recovered' for a certain length of time for some jobs.

Some of the longer sections may also cause difficulties when trying to enter some countries (e.g. America).

Flames had a good idea about coming up with some kind of agreement with the crisis team in case you get into a very bad place, maybe working out some strategies for what could be done to avoid hospital but still get you some intensive help if necessary. Do you think that might help?

[not_so_insig]

I agree with the others, perhaps working out an plan with the crisis team that works? I cant handle new people, so with them they wrote something like "keeping staff changes to a minimum and making sure that I always meet the new person twice", which really helped. I still hate the crisis team, though but it's better than a section.

Even if they do suggest hospital treatment then do go in voluntarily. The last but one time I almost got sectioned (they got out the papers and the social worker & gp were ready to sign, but before they managed to put the ink I announced that I would be willing to go into hospital. So the social worker put them away thankfully and they never came out again). I cant remember which one they were going to detain me under because I was highly psychotic (and it was about 5/6 years ago) at the time, but I would have been there at least 28 days. In the end, I was there 10 days, which of course being sectioned would have never happened.

Of course, sometimes going voluntarily instead of the Crisis Team may be better, personally it's less stressful than having them come marching in my flat (and I have gossipy old neighbours who were last time were commenting about me having lots of visitors), because I am stressed only about the first 24-48 hours, whereas the whole week they come visiting I get stressed. Also sometimes I dont feel like talking to them, whereas a couple of hours they arent there, but in hospital the nurse usually is. So instead for me it's written on my CPA that short term (like over a weekend) admissions to the local psych unit should be carried out instead of crisis where possible.

[sherlock holmes]

If you have the choice, always go in informally. Being sectioned is horrible, you cannot leave the ward unless a doctor says so and signs a section 17 form. On a section 2 you are assessed for up to 28 days on a ward, and on a section 3 you can be treated against your will for up to six months. A section 2 can be lifted, allowed to expire or transferred to a section 3. A section 3 can be renewed for a further 6 months when it is due to expire, and after that when it is renewed it lasts for 1 year at a time.

Once you are sectioned, usually it is not lifted unless you've had a managers hearing or a tribunal. Sometimes the psychiatrist may lift it early, but from personal experience my psychiatrist wanted to renew it and I wanted to go home so I had two managers hearings and a tribunal. They are not nice things to go through. It feels like you are in court, and everyone says infront of you how ill you are and why you need to be in hospital.

[J.Greens]

Wait a second here. Sectioning only happens if you resist hospital treatment, or life is at danger? So if you go volunterarily, it wouldn't be a section and thus NOT appear on an enhanced CRB?
Interesting.

Off topic - what sort of records are kept if you do end up with an CMHT? Stuff that would show up on an medical record or not?

[Soviette]

This is based mainly on what I've heard from people I've spoke to, as well as internet research. All sections can appear on enhanced CRB disclosures, but Too Shy is probably right that police sections are more likely to appear because they're solid police intelligence on you, however I have a friend who's been medically sectioned, yet it appeared on his enhanced CRB. I also read on TS.org about someone who lost their place in medical school because of a time when he overdosed and the ambulance and police came, and it turned up on his CRB. So yes, being sectioned can have implications on your future, but enhanced CRB's are only used for jobs that involve close contact with the vulnerable like the ill, children and in some cases animals like you need an enhanced CRB to become a vet or work as an RSPCA officer. Unsuprisingly, you also need an enhanced CRB to work in fields such as the Police. There is also the armed forces that don't do enhanced CRB checks, however they request access to your medical records, which is where sections are recorded, and to be in the military you need a strong mind, so it's 99.9% guarenteed you wouldn't get in with a section on your record, particularly for being suicidal or multiple amounts of self-harm.

Sorry if this sounds negative, but it's true. But it won't neccessarily stop you from doing what you want to do. There's people working in the NHS that have bad mental health histories, some of which I believe use RYL. If you get sectioned and ever require an enhanced CRB, it's best if you disclose it independently with your employer. Apparently, they will appreciate the honesty, but it's also good to know that the Disability Discrimination Act 1995 is there to protect against unnecessary discrimination on the basis of your mental health. I'm not sure how this works in real-life, but legal advice is probably a good idea if you ever find yourself in that sitch!

It's also good to know there's many fields out there that don't require an enhanced CRB either. IT, accounting, banking, many areas of science, engineering, etc. So it's not the end of the world! Oh and yeah. Apparently Section 3's have to be declared if you're travelling or planning to emigrate to the USA/Australia/Canada, I have no idea if you're able to lie about it and get away with it, though. Surely, since it's non-PNC information and only on your confidential medical records, they have no way of finding out? I don't know much about that aspect of it, though.

[J.Greens]

Finally, some answers!
Thanks.


I guess all I can do for now is keep waiting for the right opportunity. If I can get in the door, then I guess I'm as good as in. Although it is becoming more difficult watching life tick past, hm...

[not_so_insig]

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.Greens

Wait a second here. Sectioning only happens if you resist hospital treatment, or life is at danger? So if you go volunterarily, it wouldn't be a section and thus NOT appear on an enhanced CRB?
Interesting.

Anyone who goes in voluntarily is not on a section and (to a certain extent) can come and go as they like during the day. If you feel that after a certain while (say after 2 weeks +) that you do no longer want to be in hospital then you in most cases, will be able to go home, provided the discharge papers and a week's worth of medication is available. If the staff feel that you are a potential danger to you or anyone else, then they should tell you. However if you take no notice and try to go home then they will section you.

If however you are not at hospital, and get sectioned, then you will be either taken to the hospital by the police or via an ambulance (on the rare occasion, both). The only way you can leave is by being discharged by a MH worker (who does it depends on which section you are on). There is more paperwork involved, including an enhanced CPA, and you may be also subjected to an Community Treatment Order (which is basically saying "keep on taking your meds or we will take you back in"). You will not be able to leave until either you are discharged from your section or your section expires and it is not renewed (again subject to the staff thinking you are ready to leave the psych unit). You are usually have to attend an tribunal, and a solicitor is usually involved. If you are sectioned, you will be given paperwork and told what section you are detained under once in the psych unit.

So if the first case does apply, then of course you will not be sectioned and will not appear in enhanced CRBs. However, it will show up on your medical records. You may be asked (but it is not a common occurence) that for future jobs, if you have spent time in a psych unit.

[SadieLynne]

As far as I'm aware, 28 day lockdown, no contact with anyone, no technology (mobile phones, laptops MP3players etc) you have to eat what you're given, or not eat at all, you are forced to take your meds.

Someone please prove me wrong.

[whirlpools]

^ Maybe it depends where you live. In the UK it's not like that.

[Siouxsie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SarahSixx

As far as I'm aware, 28 day lockdown, no contact with anyone, no technology (mobile phones, laptops MP3players etc) you have to eat what you're given, or not eat at all, you are forced to take your meds.

Someone please prove me wrong.

It wasn't like that for me when I was sectioned, but it sounds pretty similar to the patients who had to stay in the INA area pretty much 24/7 (apart from that they were allowed to see their family members who visited, but no contact with the rest of the patients or staff apart from the ones doing their obs).

[Ballerina123]

Maybe just agree to go in voluntary. You obviouly have capacity: you can tell by the way you asked about sectioning, so you do have the choice.

Go in voluntarily and you won't need to worry about sectioning. Unless you really want to be sectioned?

[not_so_insig]

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