and I worry about putting people in that position where they think they're not hurting themselves enough / their problems are not big enough, etc, etc.
i think people get that anyway, but i would hope to a lesser extent.
Cos the ED forum had to bring about a lot of changes to stop the pro/permissive-ness of it.
If we had changes to the SID&S forum like we did in EDS, I think we'd see a lot less of this stuff that's verging on pro/permissiveness. I'm not sure what those changes would be just now, but, change would help.
But how many people would that drive away who don't want to be lectured like a naughty little child when they are just looking for acceptance?
I still think there is this whole divide down RYL that those who have ed's "suffer" from it.
Where as those who self harm bring it all down on their own heads. And I think that is a major problem, especially on a website full of teenage girls. You may stop them self harming but you are pushing them towards being anorexic or bulimic unless attitudes change.
how on earth does this make sense?
unless of course you are referring to those who have ed's.
And yes obviously getting stitches is worse than not getting stitches, but if the only talk about actual self harm is those posting in first aid that they went to far, it's easy to think that getting stitches is the norm and isn't "that" bad.
That depends, are you only living on ryl and in one frame of mind? I mean, just generally, getting stitches every second day is going to be something that people are pulled up on in real life as being not normal. To begin with most people are going to figure that out for themselves, but if you don't, I am sure the doctors/ your parents / others are going to go "hold on, that's a lot of damaged you've done there."
Quote:
Originally Posted by heidi
The comparison is people with eating disorders are congratulated for purging less or eating one meal. Surely that is the same as promoting less dangerous cutting or being cut free for an hour or something.
Actually they're not the same. People who are purging less or eating a meal are stopping the purging behaviour, even if only once out of the 3 times a day they may be doing it. Less dangerous cutting, however, is still cutting. I agree that not cutting for an hour = should be yay'ed. Not purging, same. Cutting but not as deep as usual = not yay'ed, still a problem. And that is where the open discussion, not cotton wooling should come in.
...
and I worry about putting people in that position where they think they're not hurting themselves enough / their problems are not big enough, etc, etc.
I totally agree. I know I struggle with those thoughts already... I definitely wouldn't want to see material on here that would reinforce that.
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how on earth does this make sense?
unless of course you are referring to those who have ed's.
Because the attitude seems to be that an eating disorder is an "affliction" whereas self harm is a habit. You have people going on about stopping cutting when they are still purging, so they are still self harming.
In the media eating disorders are seen as more glamourous than self harm and I think this website promotes that by going on about "people think self harm is acceptable", when actually no they don't, it's just something that they do to cope with this **** their going through.
And if starving seems better than cutting, I think many impressionable young people will follow that lead. I know for a fact people have joined here without an eating disorder and a few months on are developing one, it happens.
That depends, are you only living on ryl and in one frame of mind? I mean, just generally, getting stitches every second day is going to be something that people are pulled up on in real life as being not normal. To begin with most people are going to figure that out for themselves, but if you don't, I am sure the doctors/ your parents / others are going to go "hold on, that's a lot of damaged you've done there."
& also just because someone needs stitches doesn't mean they're problems are worse or any better.
& i know that some of the younger members would believe that those who are getting stitches are obviously worse than them. & then may not seek proper help because they do not feel worthy.
Because the attitude seems to be that an eating disorder is an "affliction" whereas self harm is a habit. You have people going on about stopping cutting when they are still purging, so they are still self harming.
with that sentence you're just pointing fingers at a certain someone to make them feel bad, wether you mean to or not.
as I was someone who posted in the forum about SI compared to smoking, I wanted to give my input.
Just wanted to thank you, as I know that wouldn't have been easy and it's much appreciated that you have given your input.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ravynsoul
However, I answered the thread about why I thought smoking was more acceptable. Not because I wanted to justify SI; but I think sometimes understanding why there is more of a stigma about something [e.g. SI vs. Smoking] can help us work towards reducing the stigma. I think sometimes the stigma prevents people from getting help.
..and, I agree with what you said. While the discussion itself I think is a valid point, what did worry me was people thinking it was okay to self harm and etc, it's not as bad as smoking rah rah, butttt, I think if we had more people giving some less cuddly answers in the thread I think the discussion about the stigma could be useful. But there is that fine line between justifying and simple discussion.
Acceptance for what? Not getting help and destroying themselves when there's chance of a better life out there?
"I cut myself with a knife until I need stitches all the time" and that thread will get 327482349234 hugs.
Or.
"I self-harm really badly but it's the only way I feel I can cope. How do I break this cycle?" ....0 posts.
I do think this is fairly hypocritical. I'm not going to go into it, because I really don't want to get annoyed, but I remember when you were in a stage like that. Not in the "OHICUTMYSELF>.<ect" stage, but when you were struggling, but your threads didn't give you any help but prevent suicide attempts for another day, when ANOTHER thread would be made for the same purpose, but mostly it was just given, "327482349234 hugs."
It wasn't all that long ago, so I don't see how you could not remember.
Acceptance for their choice.
Why don't we just kick all the non-recovery based people off RYL, including myself and be done with it then?
I'm speaking about the whole attitude in general, and yes one person in this thread may typify that, but they certainly are not the only one with that viewpoint. And if it makes those people feel bad, well good. Because I don't feel that stigmatising people on a self harm forum is exactly positive behaviour.
I'm speaking about the whole attitude in general, and yes one person in this thread may typify that, but they certainly are not the only one with that viewpoint. And if it makes those people feel bad, well good. Because I don't feel that stigmatising people on a self harm forum is exactly positive behaviour.
how on earth are we stigmatizing people?
actually in second thoughts i don't need an answer.
Location: A Dark Place Somewhere North Of The Border
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heidi Tiger
I still think there is this whole divide down RYL that those who have ed's "suffer" from it.
Where as those who self harm bring it all down on their own heads. And I think that is a major problem, especially on a website full of teenage girls. You may stop them self harming but you are pushing them towards being anorexic or bulimic unless attitudes change.
Isn't that a bit like saying people who self harm who "bring it all down on their own heads" is saying that self harmers deserve to be depressed or whatever. Sorry it just sounds a bit harsh all of the things you mentioned are addictive in my eyes there all as bad as the other and yeah i do si but before anyone calls me hypocritical I never said I was ok with it. I hate myself for it and I do hide it away because I see it as something just for me that I need to deal with, Yeah some people know but so what I have still said to the few people I talk with about it that I am addicted to it... Anything that can stop someone becoming like this is a GOOD thing.
& also just because someone needs stitches doesn't mean they're problems are worse or any better.
Oh, no no no, you're right = the size of the self harm is not indicative of the amount of pain being suffered. That's why, even when Heidi you said that scratching was okay.. I don't really think it is.
You look in the ED forum and it is all "oh well done for trying" and "oh, it's ok", which are exactly the kind of posts this thread is looking to stamp out. Or comparing cutting to smoking. Yet the ED threads seems to be escaping scot-free. And I have experienced both eating disorders and self harm, so I do know what they're both like. It just seems that one is in for more stick than the other here.
Why don't we just kick all the non-recovery based people off RYL, including myself and be done with it then?
Because we don't want that. We are not saying that people who are not recovering a bad, wrong, or do not deserve to be here. They deserve to be here like everyone else. I wanted to make that clear so I bolded it. Non-recovery is not the issue here.
You look in the ED forum and it is all "oh well done for trying" and "oh, it's ok", which are exactly the kind of posts this thread is looking to stamp out. Or comparing cutting to smoking. Yet the ED threads seems to be escaping scot-free. And I have experienced both eating disorders and self harm, so I do know what they're both like. It just seems that one is in for more stick than the other here.
the ed board is not up for discussion here, like you did with the obesity thing, if you want to discuss that then create a thread, self harm is the issues & although an eating dosorder is a form of self harm, we are discussing cutting & hurting yourself through breaking of the skin, etc etc, not what you eat [or don't as the case may be] & how you eat
Why are they so different though?
Why don't they all hang under the same barrier of "self harm" because that's what they are. And wether you are cutting or breaking the skin, burning it with chemical,ramming your fingers down your throat or starving yourself, it is essentially all the same.
