I'm sorry, but I just don't understand this line of argument.
It's your choice to steal? It's my choice to shoplift so it's ok? It's my choice to assault someone? It's my choice to mug an old lady?
Well... yes. My brother is a young offender and he made his choice to shoplift and assualt people. I didn't tell him to do it. Nobody told me to download stuff either, I just did...
I'm not saying that crime is good, not in any way, but I'm just pointing out that everybody makes their own choices. Such as, I choose what to eat, my brother chooses to commit crimes, and you choose whether to get up in the morning or not. I know they sound like rubbish comparisons, but after all I am just making a point.
Y'know... free will, and all.
"How can I be a gynecologist? I can barely look a woman in the eye!"
♥
I know it's morally wrong, I know it's illegal but I still do it although I haven't in a while. I think it's more habit than anything actually as I've been doing it for years.
Nowadays in the last year or so you don't really need to download stuff though, most movies / cartoons are avaliable on streaming websites without having to download them.
Even though the risk of getting caught is pretty low, if you do they will make an example of you so I wouldn't advise it. (Yea I'm a hypocrite).
And at the end of the day we all make that choice don't we? If I were to be prosecuted for it then thats what would happen, I'd accept that and there is nothing I could do. Don't do the crime if you can't handle the punishment etc.
I have to remind myself that some birds just aren't meant to be caged.
Their feathers are just too bright.
And when they fly away, the part of you that knows it was a sin to lock them up rejoices.
Still, the place you live in is that much more drab and empty when they're gone.
I download music, have I been caught? No. Am I likely to be caught? No.
The arguments that it is morally wrong is a faux argument because there is no such thing as moral absolutes, what one person defines as morally wrong will be different to another persons opinion. There are some who will argue that gay relationships are morally wrong, however that are many that would argue against that. If one is to say it is legally wrong to download music however, then i'm inclined to agree with you. Also it is impossible to argue that it is socially unacceptable since societal norms shift with time, at the moment a majority of internet users engage in downloading or piracy thus looking at it from a social standpoint it is normal to engage in such behaviour.
That's my two cents on the issue.
Some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money.
They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned or negotiated with.
Some men just want to watch the world burn.
I wouldn't consider it theft, I'd consider it piracy, which I'm okay with morally. To begin with, I don't believe in intellectual property and don't believe people can own ideas. As far as music goes, they may own the CDs and other merchandise they produce, but I don't believe they can own a sound wave. For it to be theft, I would have to take something that someone else owns, causing them to no longer have it. If I steal your bike, you no longer have your bike. Piracy is a copy, not theft. It would be like me copying your bike, and now we both have one. I am not taking from possible profit considering I most likely would not buy their CD if it were not available for me to download, the end product is the actual physical CD, something I care not to own or steal.
But the end product is the music to download. Someone has created that music and they have the rights to it. I couldn't just copy it and proclaim it as my own.
i used to download a lot of stuff.. now i just youtube everything and listen to it on my computer.. sometimes on repeat.. is that the same as downloading illegally? after all, im listening to a song and not paying the artist for it.
I never used to feel bad about it, cos most of the peoples music that i downloaded are multi millionaires anyway, and could survive fine without my extra 10quid.
Last edited by Dreaming. : 03-03-2009 at 09:19 PM.
Reason: Removed file-sharing site. Thanks :) x
But the end product is the music to download. Someone has created that music and they have the rights to it. I couldn't just copy it and proclaim it as my own.
I believe you could, but you wouldn't gain much legitimacy.
Do they own the relationship of words, ones they did not themselves come up with, or assemblence of chords they didn't create?
Copy rights, patents, trademarks, etc I don't believe apply and I feel no moral obligation to follow them. I respect individuals for their work, and disrespect someone for using it without acknowledging, but I don't think they should be punished; I just won't buy their product.
i used to download a lot of stuff .. now i just youtube everything and listen to it on my computer.. sometimes on repeat.. is that the same as downloading illegally? after all, im listening to a song and not paying the artist for it.
I used to use the windows media player search feature, where you could pull songs off the web but eh. I deleted it all and now I youtube everything. Most of it is from the label/artist's youtube page. As said before, a lot of artists actually have their albums up for free, so I use that as needed. My cable has "on demand" content, so I watch free movies off that. I also utilize the free episodes on some TV network's webpages to catch up if I miss an episode of a tv show. Yeah, I may have to wait a bit to see the latest movies, but tough beans. I can't afford to go out and buy them yet so I have to make due. Just like I can't afford to buy my Starbucks latte every week so I go without. Makes it even better when I finally can get it.
Buying the music and movies, to me, shows that I appreciate what the artist and film crew do and want to support them. Yeah, they don't need the money but I don't need the music either.
Last edited by Dreaming. : 03-03-2009 at 09:26 PM.
Reason: Edited quote. Thanks :)
I youtube, I guess. And most films and stuff like that, I can find online without downloading, and I like the BBCi player, and 4OD and all that stuff ^_^
Now I'll play your ghost as my ace, whenever I'm led astray.
But I am actually good, can't help it if we're tilted.
I'm in my right place, don't be a downer.
Well... yes. My brother is a young offender and he made his choice to shoplift and assualt people. I didn't tell him to do it. Nobody told me to download stuff either, I just did...
I'm not saying that crime is good, not in any way, but I'm just pointing out that everybody makes their own choices. Such as, I choose what to eat, my brother chooses to commit crimes, and you choose whether to get up in the morning or not. I know they sound like rubbish comparisons, but after all I am just making a point.
Y'know... free will, and all.
How would you feel if somebody came up to you, stole your purse, and punched you?
I'd be pissed off, I don't know about you, but I wouldn't be happy. But - oh wait, it's their choice to do that. Free will, and all.
Society can't work if we each do what we want to do, all of the time. There has to be a set of boundaries, so that people can adhere to a certain behaviour - which isn't a bad thing.
As I said before, what you seem to be saying is that it benefits you, ergo it's right.
Which is, quite frankly, a silly argument.
Rape benefits the rapers - does that make it right?
Murder benefits the murderers - does that make it right?
You seem to only focus on the artist/actor in your situation - what about the companies that produce the music, the CD creators, the artwork people, the publishers, the hundreds upon hundreds of people that work to make that. What about the shops that go out of business, because people are so busy downloading music that they don't go out and spend money in shops anymore?
You can't live in a bubble where you only what benefits you, and ignore the impact on anybody else. Imagine if everybody lived like that.
Last edited by Dreaming. : 03-03-2009 at 09:27 PM.
The point that I am trying to make is that more people illegally download than buy CDs now. I don't really think that the record companies are going to lose out on their money, because after all they are still going to get it right? People will come to concerts and buy merchandise and stuff, and maybe new fans will come along to a concert too because they heard the music by downloading it, rather than buying it. So it's not like the record companies will lose out on their money! Personally, I have better and more important things to spend my money on. I do buy from iTunes occasionally though.
"How can I be a gynecologist? I can barely look a woman in the eye!"
♥
Then you should sacrifice the luxury of music, if you have 'better' and 'more important' things to spend your money on.
I really don't like this attitude that if you can't afford something that you don't need, stealing it is acceptable.
And it's not only the record companies that will be effected, though! What about the shops that sell albums - especially indie shops? What about the designers & photographers, who do the cover? What about the publicity people? What about record sales - how will the record company know what is popular and what isn't?
Not to mention the fact that you're completely removing all accountability, all responsibility for the music market. One expects other people to buy CDs & Music, to do tours & gigs, for the record company to continue producing CDs, so that you can steal from them?
And may I ask - you identified that you wouldn't steal from a shop - where's the difference between this and that?
And can you concede why I feel it's wrong to steal like that, even if you don't agree with it?
Hmm... I wouldn't steal from a shop because that it just plain wrong. Listen, I don't want to get into an argument here. I know downloading is bad, but I still do it. Thousands of people do it on a daily basis and the music and video publishing industry isn't exactly being harmed... Downloading is not a good thing for the record companies but it can be quite good, if you think about it. I don't want to get into an argument so I'm just going to go now. Thanks for your input, I'll have a think about it.
x
"How can I be a gynecologist? I can barely look a woman in the eye!"
♥
The point that I am trying to make is that more people illegally download than buy CDs now.
Source?
Quote:
I don't really think that the record companies are going to lose out on their money, because after all they are still going to get it right? People will come to concerts and buy merchandise and stuff, and maybe new fans will come along to a concert too because they heard the music by downloading it, rather than buying it.
One person buys a legal single/album, one hundred people then copy this. One of those people allow another hundred to copy their copy. It goes on and on. Of course they are losing out on money. I'd hazard a guess that more people hear music through the radio or through work of mouth recommendations, or support acts than they do by randomly downloading songs. Don't most people only download what they already like?
Quote:
I have better and more important things to spend my money on. I do buy from iTunes occasionally though.
So do we all. I have better things to spend my money on which is why I do without new music, or I listen to the radio. Music is not a necessity in life. If you can't obtain it legally, you don't get it. I would really, really like a new pair of boots but right now I cannot afford the £100 that they cost. I do without.
because after all they are still going to get it right? People will come to concerts and buy merchandise and stuff,
Youre kind of right, the live music industry is booming at the minute.
but..
bands lose a lot of money on merchandise, theres a concession of 20% - 25% in pretty much every venue in the country.
Its a huge bone of contention and most people hate it, because it means the merchandising companies and the venues are taking what is essentially the bands money. So when you go to a gig and buy a t-shirt, and you think your money is going to the band, about a quarter of it isnt.
ulimately, people are losing money, and CD seling outlets are closing.
Last edited by squirrelspit : 03-03-2009 at 09:46 PM.
I thought it was just a discussion about the topic, so I was just trying to discuss it, and understand more of what you were saying.
Ah right... okay.
Well, do you see my point? About how downloading is bad but good at the same time? Bad because the record companies and artists lose out on their money. Good, because it gets music spread across to more people who perhaps haven't heard of the artists and will then go and spend money on tickets to see the artist/band live.
"How can I be a gynecologist? I can barely look a woman in the eye!"
♥
