Thing is Rachel, I have made massive changes and grown up a lot. I think as much as you think I have formed opinions on what people say and find it difficult to change, others, specifically you as you've known me longer also have set opinions on me that your portray back onto me. You think I only see what I want to hear, but I think often the same can be said about you.
Not sure if that made sense, because I'm exhausted. But whatever. I know I'm not alone in my views, by the posts here and the amount of PMs I've had this evening, so that will do for now.
Liv has made some amazing points here today I can't even quote them all but i agree 100%, and I'm very very glad you're on the moderating team to represent these views. No pressure, but never leave <3
Thank you Aimee, that means a lot <3
There are times to stay put, and what you want will come to you.
But there are times to go out into the world and find such a thing for yourself.
I aint no abacus but you can count on me.
I think I agree with this, in the context of internet forums. I do believe there's a time and place for persistent tough love (when balanced with lots of actual love too!), but I don't think here is the place, especially between people who are practically strangers. I think unless it's coming from someone who really knows you and is a big part of your life, it will not be effective and probably do more harm than good.
I also think there's a real possibility that some people think 'tough love' is synonymous with being downright rude, and use 'tough love' as justification for getting frustrated with someone and being pernickety and snipe-y at them and it gives genuine tough love a bad name!
I said I was going to stop talking and I just talked more -.-
I agree completely! It is definitely the case that some people think that approach is rude and there is a lot of the using tough love as justification going around at the moment.
As an aside, I have read other threads and caught up with the reasons behind this thread, however I think that if its seen objectively without making it person this is a very important discussion to have and one that has been brewing for quite a while now.
There are times to stay put, and what you want will come to you.
But there are times to go out into the world and find such a thing for yourself.
I aint no abacus but you can count on me.
I kind of agree with the notion of if a person asks you to stop replying/reply in a different way, then you should respect that. If you go back for another shot at 'tough love' after it's been expressed that it's not appropriate at that time, then that's not okay. I know I've found myself wanting to post 'pull yourself together and deal with it' type replies before, but felt I shouldn't and left it be, and it is frustrating when you feel as though your time and advice and support have been totally ignored, but I know that sometimes it happens for various reasons and that's the nature of situation.
I know, personally, why I prefer to give practical advice rather than 'hugs' alone - because that's what I always want when I post. I honestly find posts looking purely for emotional support/hugs difficult to reply to as I know it may become quite circular, but I also understand that often, a person might just need that affirmation that there is someone listening and acknowledging their feelings. Wow, I think I've gone majorly off topic.
All I'm trying to say, is that I can understand why people try to give the 'tough love' approach, but I think that after it's been established that it won't be helpful then it becomes rude and inappropriate and that needs to stop.
(Hoping I don't sound like a douche and/or total wally)
Now I'll play your ghost as my ace, whenever I'm led astray.
But I am actually good, can't help it if we're tilted.
I'm in my right place, don't be a downer.
No entirely sure what that has to do with the conversation!
There are times to stay put, and what you want will come to you.
But there are times to go out into the world and find such a thing for yourself.
I aint no abacus but you can count on me.
I think that there should be a middle ground for "tough love" and "no advice/hug posts", but sometimes even if the person doesn't want it, if they continually ask for support and take no advice people give, it's time for tough love (unless there is a really good, valid reason as to why they don't take the advice like financial issues). Not saying that you, Nymph, deserve it since I haven't read your posts.
This is a a little off topic, but what about people who don't even get advice at all? There is a reason as to why I've stopped posting in Serious Discussion so much. Because no one seems to want to give me advice. Hugs are good and all, but I'd really like advice. I finally have professional help which has been advised to me many times when I joined. Now, I have it, but I'd still like advice from people here. My last really long Serious thread ended in like 5 million posts of me talking to myself because people I guess didn't give a **** anymore. So I thought, "Well, since no one wants to give me any advice, I'll just making a ranting thread." cause that's all my thread became. A ranting thread in Serious Discussion. It really frustrates me that I look to people for advice and I get none.
I know there was a push for replying to 0 reply threads, but obviously, the push didn't work that well.
Sorry. I just needed to say that cause it's been on my shoulders for months now.
Major Depression | Asperger's Syndrome | Anxiety NOS | Hints of OCD
Close your eyes. Don't you cry. Love's around you. In time, you'll fly. Don't you worry about the dark. I will light up the night with the love in my heart. I will burn like the sun that will keep you safe and warm. Like the smell of a rose on a summer's day, I will be there to take all your fears away. With the touch of my hand, I will turn your life to GOLD!
And it's just not me! I've seen it with other people, too! I've even tried to reply to their threads, but I can't think of advice, so I just have to sit back and hope SOMEONE on this site will give the person advice!
Major Depression | Asperger's Syndrome | Anxiety NOS | Hints of OCD
Close your eyes. Don't you cry. Love's around you. In time, you'll fly. Don't you worry about the dark. I will light up the night with the love in my heart. I will burn like the sun that will keep you safe and warm. Like the smell of a rose on a summer's day, I will be there to take all your fears away. With the touch of my hand, I will turn your life to GOLD!
Maybe we just need to respect each other and our wishes a little more. Different things work for different people. If you want advice, ask for it and hopefully someone will have some. I simply asked for support, clearly requested in my first post, I think that's what made it harder.
I didn't mean for this to become all about me. My own thread experience triggered the post, but it's something I've noticed for a while. Bullying people and calling it support, and no ones said anything. So I did, and I'm glad I did because people agree and have thanked me for saying things they couldn't/haven't.
And it's just not me! I've seen it with other people, too! I've even tried to reply to their threads, but I can't think of advice, so I just have to sit back and hope SOMEONE on this site will give the person advice!
Maybe this is what happened to your threads; people couldn't think of advice. But also longer threads are more likely to trail off into no replies because a lot of people are used to looking for threads with few replies to reply to; when I guess they should also look at the last poster.
I think this was discussed somewhere else anyway recently.
I agree with Nymphette - just show some respect. If your brand of advice is clearly upsetting someone, don't keep hitting them over the head with it. Respect the differences in people, including stages of recovery.
I haven't read anything else by the original poster so I don't know if I'm replying out of context as I'm not aware of what else is going on, but as a general reply, I think this:
I've found this website very supportive in general over the years. I do think recently there's been a slight shift away from helpful responses to less helpful ones but that may be simply the threads I read and also I guess things fluctuate over time. So that may be my perception rather than an actuality.
I hope that everyone would try to be sensitive to other people and maybe remember what they felt like at their worst. I sometimes read threads and I'm not sure what to say in case what I post is perceived as criticism and I don't want it to be perceived that way but I can't think of what else to say or how else to phrase it. I know recently I was thrown by a thread and I think it was a case of crossed wires and had I sat down with the people face to face I think there would have been a much different outcome. I also think things can sound harsher written down as there's no jokey tone or even any intonation or expression as there is with voice. Sometimes communication over an online forum or even by text (or any written/electronic means) can miss out on subtleties when that wouldn't happen in communication in person.
It's a sad day here when people are being told to make ranting threads to avoid nasty responses in their own thread of support. Everyone should be entitled to support without fear of nasty, judgmental and unhelpful replies.
I see many posts have been deleted, I hope that means the mods are recognizing this, even if some members are not. Thank you team of mods. x
Not having read the thread in question, I'm not going to comment on that.
However, does there need to be a separation of "advice" and "support", like some have suggested? Surely the best replies would have a bit of both.
I know that I get annoyed when people don't take responsibility for themselves, because ultimately I know that if they don't nothing will change. Having said that, I know that not everyone is of the same mind frame as me and some people simply want to bury their heads. What people NEED to hear is very rarely that same as what they WANT to hear, and sometimes that should be challenged. By and large they'll appreciate it in the long run. Sometimes I feel that RYL enables people and almost encourages people to wallow with it's culture of *hugs* and "don't worry, that's okay" cultures.
