He gave me a letter, an appointment to see a therapist in a week. and told me he's referred me three times, finally getting seen, though. And I started getting upset then.
I told him I was nervous about seeing a therapist because I don't want to talk about thing, I've managing by shoving all emotion and anything bad to one side and not dealing. But talking about things, I don't know if I can. And I don't want this therapist to say what I've heard in the past, that I'm wasting their time, there are other people they could be seeing, there's no point me going if I'm not gonna talk (because that makes me calm down so I can get words out).
Then he spoke about moving out. I'm in a mental health THU (transitional housing unit), and it's usually about a six month stay, but they can extend every six months up until two years, then you gotta go. I've been here just over a year.
He told me, realistically, they're looking to move you out in the next six months, and I've gotta prepare for that. I didn't even need to tell him that I didn't feel ready at all, he went straight on to saying he didn't think I would manage living independent, and he thinks if I moved out, I would go downhill within a few months, and he doesn't want me to go back into hospital. He didn't add to that, just left it hanging.
Of course, getting really upset and just continuously crying. I know what downhill is, and that's exactly how I feel, that if I leave, I'll go downhill and end up back in hospital. I don't engage the THU staff often, but enough it keeps me from doing A&E worthy things most the time. I'm not at all ready or prepared, and I had thought I would see a therapist shortly after leaving hospital over a year ago, but it's not happened, and my way of dealing with things on my own is to not deal with them, because I can't (staff are nice, but not really trained) and that's how I've been doing it all this time, now to suddenly start talking about things again, I don't think I can do it without breaking down.
I also asked him for anti-anxiety meds. It's been so difficult, I've stopped music lessons, I've stopped going to the gym, I just can't really go out, can't do anything social (except board game group once a week with help of close friend and alcohol). I just feel I need medication to help make things manageable.
And he said no. He said he doesn't want to put me on anti-anxiety, because [he thinks] the anxiety is part of my autism, which is part of who I am. And I need to learn to manage it myself.
Just broke down, crying, and my throat closed up, hyperventilating a little, I couldn't speak after that. Still crying an hour later. He even asked after that, "why are crying? I don't want to upset you"
So he left, and I felt awful, hopelessness. Felt that again. Not felt that so strongly in a while. I just sat in my flat and thought about hanging myself. That strong urge has lessened to what it is now, I need to get some things in order first. I feel so messed up
it sounds like you managed to communicate fairly well to your CPN some of the things that are worrying you, well done. Did he have any advice for your worries about seeing a therapist? I hope that this therapist is helpful for you and that you don't feel pressured. Do you think it would be possible to communicate your worries in the first appointment next week about not being able to talk straight away? Is there anything that has helped you to open up in therapy in the past?
It sounds scary to not know when you are going to have to move out of the THU, but a lot can change in six months. It is important to communicate with people why you feel you are not ready to leave, and maybe you can work with your CPN to think about putting some things in place to make things a little easier for when the time does come for you to move on?
It sounds like you are struggling with a lot of anxiety at the moment. I'm sorry that it has stopped you from doing things that you enjoy although I am glad you are still managing to keep some social time in with the board game group. Do you think you would be able to try something a little different - maybe with this close friend? Is there anything else that might make it easier to go out or to go back to the gym?
I still think it is worth bringing up the anxiety medication with your CPN again, perhaps when you are feeling calmer. Can you explain that you accept that your autism can make things difficult for you but you have been feeling like this is extra anxiety recently and separate from the autism (if that is how you feel)?
How are you feeling today? Is there someone you can speak to if you get strong urges again?
"this is the room where you don't have to be brave"
He advised I write things down before me session, and he offered me a life home afterwards, so I wouldn't have to go out and catch a bus.
Not a lot has changed in the last six or so years. I don't expect things to change in the next six months.
I don't know why I'm not ready to leave. I'm terrified of living on my own, and I'm sure I'll get really bad, but I don't know why.
I could give a lesson on ASD and comorbid disorders, and I made sure I'd see him in two weeks, not the 1 1/2 - 2 months we normally do. So I'll pull some information to show him that what he said is absolute nonsense.
One of my key workers is in today, so she's around. Or my close friend, she had me come to hers yesterday, she knows how bad my thoughts got, I don't think she'd be upset if I needed to talk to her again.
I spoke to my key worker here. She said it looks like cpn is thinking of discharging me.
And he had said that during our meeting.
She told me services are changing, there's less funding, the one I'm under might close, CPN's will only take on people who are in crisis. So if you're bad, struggling, really bad, can't work, can't go to uni, can't leave the house, can't do anything, falling apart... if you're not falling over the edge in crisis, you can't get help. Was that supposed to make me feel better?
I feel so crap. I just want to die. I don't see how things can improve. Or I see they can get "better" but there's nothing lasting. I just see things ending up being awful, living, existence, being so awful. I don't want to carry on like that.
HI Rilic, I agree with you that it sounds like....not sense- but on the positive side you do have the ability to not be in crisis at all times.
If there is general agreement that living independently is not a good idea after THU, what are your options?
Whether this CPN is discharging you or not- you are scheduled to be seen by a therapist right?
Sometimes, learning to advocate for ourselves is hard stuff. The negative images come with the anxiety- but you also have to work through believing that you are worth not giving up on.
Please make sure that your team know that you are struggling with the suicidal ideation and like it was suggested bring up the medication and housing.
There probably are supports in the community- unfortunately it probably includes music lessons and gym- could you get a support worker to help you restart?
~Happy tomatoes together we will be~
You say toe- may- toe, I say toe- mah- toe:
Let's call the whole thing- red
“It’s time to lead the third revolution, which is not to say we want to be at the top of the world, but to say we want to change the world. Because the way the world has been designed by men is not working. It’s not working for women, it’s not working for men,
it’s not working for polar bears.” Arianna Huffington 2014
I don't think that's an ability. It just happens there haven't been any pressures, and I don't know how to handle when they're stuck on me like the other day. Last night was bad. Key worker was on sleep, and she did a welfare check and found out I'd done something, she called crisis team, who told her to get an ambulance, so she called an ambulance but I refused to go to A&E. But the second time, they said I had to go, or they'd get the police there, and then the doctor who saw me wouldn't let me leave until I'd seen crisis there. But I waited til handover then left. I don't like crisis team.
We don't know what the options are for moving on. They have possible
"permanent" flats with this service, but don't know if one will become available in time.
If it's a psychotherapist, I don't have good history with them. It can take a few weeks of seeing someone to trust them and start opening up. And that's if they're patient in that time and don't demand I talk about things that are obviously difficult. And obvious anxiety is obvious. I usually get told by psychotherapists that I'm wasting their time and other things that make me feel bad.
Also, don't know how many sessions they might give me.
I know I'm jumping on the super negative train at the moment, I'm really, really down. Can't see the positives, so suppose I just sound really difficult to everyone. But it's not on purpose. I wish I could see positives and the little things.
Can you explain why you don't like the crisis team? Is there a way you could talk to someone when you are feeling in a crisis before it gets to the stage where you have to go to A&E? (I'm aware I'm probably making it all sound much more simple than it is)
Maybe it's worth trying to pinpoint what it is about you moving on that is causing you so much anxiety? Things can feel really overwhelming but if you could break it down into individual issues (e.g. I might not have someone to talk to at night if there's a crisis) then maybe you can work on putting things in place to try to deal with them?
I'm glad you managed to talk to your key worker the other day (although I know what she said made you feel bad) and that you have another appointment with your CPN soon - as I think it is really important that you communicate your feelings.
Can you ask your CPN or a key worker about the options available for moving on so you can start to explore what might be available for you?
Try not to worry about your therapy (I know that's hard). It is definitely worth trying to explain your anxieties in the first appointment though and that you feel it takes you some time to open up so that hopefully they can be more patient with you.
"this is the room where you don't have to be brave"
First, thank you for responding again. it really helps to have somewhere to talk things out. And I see you have this positive steps approach, which I can't see myself right now, but I keep reading it in your posts.
The crisis team are just very dismissive. There's not a lot they can do anyway.
I try with the staff here. It's just that when you feel terrible, a 10/20 chat isn't going to make all that go away. My friend helps, because she will stay up with me and watch tv or play games, but she's not always available because she has work and sometimes she stays with her boyfriend across the country.
That's something I need to do. Break it all down, maybe with the therapist? I don't know. I don't know if there's anything that can be put in place. I know I particularly struggle at night. There's nothing that can be done about that once i'm on my own.
My CPN should be informed on what happened the other night, but a mix of (mostly) past experience and pessimism says he won't get in touch next week. He hasn't in the past when i've been bad. He still might, I can't call it.
My keyworker is looking for places to move on to. It's just tricky because I will not live in certain areas or homes. I just won't. There's no point accepting them or pretending it'd be okay because I'd just finish myself off I was stuck there.
I'm really gonna try at this appointment. I'm afraid of another black mark on my record (not engaging), but I've been trying to get a therapist for ten years, I want this one to work out.
I'm glad that you can identify some of the things that your friend does with you that helps when you're feeling really bad. Although its tricky when she isn't always around. I understand that it might feel like talking to the staff won't make it all go away but do you think there is something they could do that would be helpful? Are they able to have a chat and then check in on you half an hour later for example, and help you to plan what you are going to do in that half an hour to stay safe?
I think it's a really good idea to try to break it all down with the therapist. Perhaps a lot of the anxiety at the moment is related to not knowing what is going to happen or what could be put in place, and it might take some working through but finding out your options could be helpful. I think night time is a time that can be particularly tricky as it feels like there is nobody there but that doesn't necessarily have to be the case. At the very least there is the crisis team and there are helplines you could try. But there might also be the potential for a night support worker or some other support that we just don't know about yet.
If your CPN doesn't get in touch are you able to get in touch with him? I'm glad your keyworker is looking into places for you to move to though, hopefully there will be some options that you would consider soon.
I'm really glad it sounds like you are able to have a positive outlook about this appointment. I think it's a good idea to try to communicate as soon as possible that you can have difficulties in engaging and if there is anything you can think of that might have helped you to engage in the past. Also could you make a note of any questions you might have so that you remember to ask them in the first appointment too?
"this is the room where you don't have to be brave"
I am sorry that you find the crisis team are dismissive of you. Could you clarify or give an example? I used to present to A&E if I had the urge to- and before I-do/did anything. It was an extreme response, but I found that it changed my outlook of a safe place.
Night time remains a vulnerable time for me, but since I am in a more pressured situation, I now have even more of a skill set and parameters for staying safe.
What would be the goal/ role of the crisis team in your case?
~Happy tomatoes together we will be~
You say toe- may- toe, I say toe- mah- toe:
Let's call the whole thing- red
“It’s time to lead the third revolution, which is not to say we want to be at the top of the world, but to say we want to change the world. Because the way the world has been designed by men is not working. It’s not working for women, it’s not working for men,
it’s not working for polar bears.” Arianna Huffington 2014
Crisis team, whenever I've called, they just recommend distraction methods, which is useless because I wouldn't be calling if I hadn't tried those already and they weren't working. there was a time I was on the phone for less than five minutes and told "I can't stay on the phone with you all night" because I told them their suggestions weren't helpful.
There was I time I was really suicidal, they gave the usual "have a bath, watch tv, go for a walk, go to bed".... NOT HELPFUL!!! and I made a serious suicide attempt after that.
Since then, not called them, but the staff here will, and they argue with them until they get told to send me to A&E. Now that's usually okay, except for the odd time nurses have said things along the lines of you shouldn't be here, we don't do mental health (worse things than that, but along those lines), and now A&E is so far from where I live, it's not practical. I'd have to get a taxi, and that just costs too much. Or I could walk, about two-ish hours.
I don't know what the crisis team could do to make things better, you just get in this mind where I hope they have answers, because I'm out.
Staff realistically wont do checks that often. They know if I'm bad, it's gonna be bad all night, and they try plans, but they also know they're probably gonna wake up in the morning to find I've done something.
I met the psychologist (I think she's finding out what therapy would work? I don't really know. I don't know how many times I'll see her). My impressions were she is patient, and observant, which is good with me. A lot of my cues are visual. But I don't remember. I remember getting confused part way through meeting her, and that's a big sign of my dissociating. I can't remember the meeting much.
It's very difficult to get in touch with him. but he's hopefully gonna see me a little more often because I've been bad recently. I have written he should see me on Friday.
Maybe the crisis team is not the telephone support you need then. Is there an alternative support line? There was one specific to my city that forwarded a summary of the call to my GP.
I hope that your psychologist can help you identify triggers and warnings signs. However, regarding the various distractions not working- there is a space between trying those and the incidence where you are unsafe that you need to learn to extend.
Can you think about the nights that you did not do anything and how you got through them?
The goal is that each night is a new challenge. And towards recovery is increasing the number of nights that you stay safe.
You cannot be expected to do it alone- but essentially it is for you alone (you as the priority in your own mind) that it must be done.
Please remember that you matter. That you deserve to get better. And that tomorrow may be the day that you do....so you shouldn't give up.
~Happy tomatoes together we will be~
You say toe- may- toe, I say toe- mah- toe:
Let's call the whole thing- red
“It’s time to lead the third revolution, which is not to say we want to be at the top of the world, but to say we want to change the world. Because the way the world has been designed by men is not working. It’s not working for women, it’s not working for men,
it’s not working for polar bears.” Arianna Huffington 2014
I feel about done with my cpn.
He brought up moving out AGAIN, when he knows it upsets. He will keep saying "you'll have to move out eventually".. which I KNOW, but I need help to be okay to live on my own first, and it's been a year and I've only just had my first meeting with a psychologist!!! It's gonna take time.
I brought up medication again, and he said okay. He'll pass it on to a consultant.
WHAT THE HELL?!!?!? Last time he said no, because autism blah blah. Why do that? Why make me feel like crap, just to go okay this time? What was the point of saying no?
I can't remember much of the appointment with psychologist, and I told him I don't remember what we spoke about, and he said it was a choice. I don't have dementia or memory problems so I must be choosing to not remember.
I don't have memory problems?!?!
I got so angry, and told saying that was utter crap when everyone know I struggle with my memory and remembering what people talk about.
Also people know I struggle with dissociation, and my memory of when I'm dissociated isn't great.
Then he made some comment about "it's nice to see you angry"... did he only say that to try and make me angry.
Upset again after that. Feels now that he keeps saying things to get a reaction, which is messing with my head and my emotions.
The last thing he said was something about my childhood, and nah-ah. Shut that s((t down. I will f))king punch him if he brings up my childhood in the way he brings up other things.
Hi Rilic,
The medication is important to you. It is frustrating, but by advocating for yourself- the cpn will pass it onto the consultant because only they can make the medication change. I don't know why they said no- the first time- but maybe in following up with the medication you can ask them?
I am not sure that I am following your psychologist either. You are now working with them so it will take time to build a rapport. I don't know if they could have said it differently. But like you said it may be dissociation that triggers memory issues- and not memory issues in terms of having a degenerative condition, or being impacted all the time.
Those two points about the memory problems and the "nice to see you angry"- could you document it and hold it for your next session. Also that talking about your childhood is not something you want to deal with as an after thought in therapy.
I felt that at some point my relationship with my therapist was not working for me. However, in another instance, change was taking place and it was uncomfortable and frustrating- so it wasn't like "I cannot wait to go to therapy"- but in the end I am glad I persisted.
The goal of moving may be one you want to avoid right now, but a plan may need to be put in place to know specifically what skills you will need to move out before you know where or feel ready.
You are amazingly brave. Keep communicating even though it is hard- because you are the expert in how you cope- and they are not mind readers.
~Happy tomatoes together we will be~
You say toe- may- toe, I say toe- mah- toe:
Let's call the whole thing- red
“It’s time to lead the third revolution, which is not to say we want to be at the top of the world, but to say we want to change the world. Because the way the world has been designed by men is not working. It’s not working for women, it’s not working for men,
it’s not working for polar bears.” Arianna Huffington 2014
But if your anxiety is affecting your day to day life and you've already tried the self help stuff (deep breathing, going for a walk, cbt, distraction techniques,) and then you can say that's that you have tried all these they are not helping you manage it and you need something such as anti anxiety to cope with it.
Personally I find that the self help stuff is great for very mild and insignificant problems in daily life that a resolution. I find that I am worried about the dishwasher breaking down or if I have sprained my ankle I can use distractions to take my mind off the problem. But for illnesses such as severe depression, generalised anxiety or self harm or serious bloke issues, uni or work etc. Then self help isn't really gonna help it.
Have you ever confused a dream with life? Or stolen something when you have the cash? Have you ever been blue? Or thought your train moving while sitting still? Maybe I was just crazy. Maybe it was the 60's. Or maybe I was just a girl... interrupted.
I know what it's like to want to die. How it hurts to smile. How you try to fit in but you can't. How you hurt yourself on the outside to try to kill the thing on the inside. I tried groups, didn't work out just made my depression a lot worse.
