Suicide is legal in many countries. In New Zealand it even qualifies family members as eligible for a type of funding people can get if they are injured by an accident (for treatment, and if they can't go to work etc). How silly is that? Suicide aint an accident!
Even as the stone of the fruit must break
that its heart may stand in the sun,
so must you know pain.
There are only two ways in which one can live their life. One is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is.
I think it is rather egocentric to let an animal suffer even more and not deciding to put it down but for it to hold on as long as it can.. you are just sticking around with your fist up your ass watching your animal hopelessly living.. they probably can't handle the nostalgia once they're gone, which you can understand.
The whole argument is vacillated because you have the religious proclaiming that God will end life when he wants to and the sanctimonious "moralist" who then claim it is unwise to take the life of another person at any stage of agony and that their attitude towards life transitioning into death is suppose to be a triage and that assisted suicide would ruin it.
Besides, it's not just the terminally ill animals that get put down at the pound, it's also the ones who don't have a place to stay and are not taken in by a specific time.. as unfortunate as it sounds, that is the truth.
But they could, without being arrested and slammed in prison for murder.
I think euthanasia should become widespread, easily accessible treatment. Yes put criteria on it, fine. But de-criminalise it for goodness' sake!
Oh, yes, they could. I was just commenting on Adam saying we put animals down but not humans. For some people putting their animal down is a heart-wrenching experience and they feel like they've killed their family member.
I'd like to see more, and better, palliative care before we went down the route of euthanasia, although palliative care is probably more expensive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asura
While we're on legalising Euthanasia under specific criteria, why not legalise suicide?
Suicide has never been illegal in Scotland as far as I know, and it has been legal in the rest of the UK for about fifty years now.
A friend of mine raised a very interesting point yesterday that is kind of relevant. The people who have supposedly the "best" genes, the educated, intelligient people are the ones who are choosing to not have kids, or to focus on their career first until they can afford kids etc. And the ones who couldn't care less and are the worst people you want to breed, are the ones having loads of kids.
I was just thinking in terms of the voluntary human extinction thing, or a one child policy. The people who would suscribe to those ideas will be at least somewhat educated in order to see there is an overpopulation problem etc. Does that mean that if all the intelligent people stop having children humans will "devolve" and become less intelligent?
it would certainly mean that intelligent people will be outnumbered by the less intelligent.
But that was always the case. Human civilisation has always been moved on by that one intelligent person and their innovation. the less than average are content to remain where they are. Even with early human technology. it stayed the same for thousands of years before one bright spark thought "How about we try cooking the meat?"
Don't be fooled by my smooth skin. The deepest scars are the ones unseen.
Remember compliments you received, forget the insults. If you succeed in doing this, tell me how..~ Baz Lurhman.
Letting it get to you - You know what that's called? Being alive. Best thing there is. Being alive right now that's all that counts. ~ Doctor Who "The Doctors Wife" 06.November.2011
Selective breeding (eugenics) doesn't end up working..
It's all natural selection.. But even IQ doesn't mean sh*t.. I think it is the quality of the human-being that matters, what they could bring to the table.. I know plenty of people who aren't the brightest and sharpest tool in the shed but are one of the best blokes to meet.
I think the world was suppose to be civilized into tribes of 100-250 people.
I'd like to see more, and better, palliative care before we went down the route of euthanasia, although palliative care is probably more expensive.
Much more expensive, just worsens the overpopulation problem, contributes further to waste (ie. human waste, buildings to house them, fuel to move them and feed them etc) and puts even more strain on the taxpayer. I'd also argue, not always wanted. It's cruel to force people to live, potentially for years, dependent on nurses to feed them and wipe their bums, humiliated and stripped of dignity, just so they can eventually die "naturally". If they want to go, let them go, I say.
Even as the stone of the fruit must break
that its heart may stand in the sun,
so must you know pain.
There are only two ways in which one can live their life. One is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is.
Suicide has never been illegal in Scotland as far as I know, and it has been legal in the rest of the UK for about fifty years now.
Is that right?
If it were truly legal there would be no intervention by public authorities to prevent suicide attempts, nor sectioning, etc. I fail to see how it is "legal" to take one's life if there is so much undesired intervention by the state.
Last edited by Asura : 20-07-2012 at 12:42 AM.
Nous avons abrité tous les rêves du monde,
Et c'est dans le soleil que nous avons grandi.
Is that right?
If it were truly legal there would be no intervention by public authorities to prevent suicide attempts, nor sectioning, etc. I fail to see how it is "legal" to take one's life if there is so much undesired intervention by the state.
There may be intervention, but there is no prosecution. That's the difference.
Also as to the general topic of this thread, my opinion is thus: if there is an unsustainable amount of people on the planet, the laws of nature will sort everything out, and there is no need for human intervention. I try not to worry about it.
Much more expensive, just worsens the overpopulation problem, contributes further to waste (ie. human waste, buildings to house them, fuel to move them and feed them etc) and puts even more strain on the taxpayer. I'd also argue, not always wanted. It's cruel to force people to live, potentially for years, dependent on nurses to feed them and wipe their bums, humiliated and stripped of dignity, just so they can eventually die "naturally". If they want to go, let them go, I say.
It's possible to have both though, is it not? Palliative care may allow someone to die with some amount of dignity in a place that's more "like home" than on some clinical ward somewhere. Yes, it's more expensive, but is that all that matters? A lot of drug treatments are incredibly expensive, and offer little benefit, yet some people can access them through the NHS.
I think it's also cruel to make people feel obligated to die through euthanasia rather than continue to be a burden on their family, friends and the state. Which can, and I believe would, happen if we went down the euthanasia route.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asura
Is that right?
If it were truly legal there would be no intervention by public authorities to prevent suicide attempts, nor sectioning, etc. I fail to see how it is "legal" to take one's life if there is so much undesired intervention by the state.
As already said, there's no prosecution, although there may well be arrest. The police and other authorities have a duty to public safety, whether or not you want that safety, and it's a fairly common aspect of their job. There was something in the news the other day, the police in Tayside collected statistics saying that they deal with about 150 suicide-related incidents a month, one from a child aged nine.
As already said, there's no prosecution, although there may well be arrest. The police and other authorities have a duty to public safety, whether or not you want that safety, and it's a fairly common aspect of their job. There was something in the news the other day, the police in Tayside collected statistics saying that they deal with about 150 suicide-related incidents a month, one from a child aged nine.
Why arrest?
Most suicide attempts that fail land people into the ER where they are treated possibly for a prolonged period of time and then admit them to the psychiatric ward. Unless you meant retaining them in case of further harm then yes but arresting someone after an attempt is stupid.
Why arrest?
Most suicide attempts that fail land people into the ER where they are treated possibly for a prolonged period of time and then admit them to the psychiatric ward. Unless you meant retaining them in case of further harm then yes but arresting someone after an attempt is stupid.
It may lead to arrest in order to keep them restrained for their own safety. It's not always possible for the police to get you to a hospital and to get you a suitable place there, so they arrest you so as to keep you in the cells overnight.
It's possible to have both though, is it not? Palliative care may allow someone to die with some amount of dignity in a place that's more "like home" than on some clinical ward somewhere. Yes, it's more expensive, but is that all that matters? A lot of drug treatments are incredibly expensive, and offer little benefit, yet some people can access them through the NHS.
Yes by all means have both! I just brought this up because at the moment the option for euthanasia is widely illegal and I don't think it shoud be.
The thing about expensive drug treatments is a whole other contentious issue!
Even as the stone of the fruit must break
that its heart may stand in the sun,
so must you know pain.
There are only two ways in which one can live their life. One is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is.
I think the world is fine as it is really, but if people continue as they are with the amount of violence and new drugs going around, there will be a lot of casualties to come.
I honestly can't understand how anyone could think the world is fine.
Global warming?
Climate change?
Longer, more stressful working hours?
Higher costs of living?
Extinctions?
Pollution?
Disease?
Starvation?
Even as the stone of the fruit must break
that its heart may stand in the sun,
so must you know pain.
There are only two ways in which one can live their life. One is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is.
I honestly can't understand how anyone could think the world is fine.
Global warming?
Climate change?
Longer, more stressful working hours?
Higher costs of living?
Extinctions?
Pollution?
Disease?
Starvation?
This.
Don't be fooled by my smooth skin. The deepest scars are the ones unseen.
Remember compliments you received, forget the insults. If you succeed in doing this, tell me how..~ Baz Lurhman.
Letting it get to you - You know what that's called? Being alive. Best thing there is. Being alive right now that's all that counts. ~ Doctor Who "The Doctors Wife" 06.November.2011
I honestly can't understand how anyone could think the world is fine.
I think they mean that for them and their life the world will continue to tick along with little impact. Increased costs of living and such are just facts of life, something that the vast majority of people just suck up and get on with. Of course, I could be totally wrong!
You're probably right, but I think people who think like that are being naive. Our lives will be affected, anyone currently under the age of about 60 should be looking into the future and panicking because honestly the way we are carrying on, things are going to run out.
Even as the stone of the fruit must break
that its heart may stand in the sun,
so must you know pain.
There are only two ways in which one can live their life. One is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is.
