I am unsure what I am even asking.

[Auror.]

Ok so I'm really really sorry for making a new thread. I don't know what I'm doing and I don't have anybody in real life right now so I just am really alone. If you even read this thank you. <3

I'm scared because nothing is changing. It's been a year of things being consistently this bad and I thought it would at least go away or get better or something. But obviously it has not because I am not dead, which is the only thing that would make it better even though that is not what I want.

I'm sick of doctors, hospitals, therapists, anything. Any of it. All of it. I don't want attention. I don't want drama. I want to be able to go to class and do my schoolwork and get a new job and just be somewhat functional. I don't want things to be bad. I want people to be safe and I want things to be okay.

But all of it is completely unattainable. I feel like nobody knows what to do with me because none of it is a big deal. I don't like being labelled an attention seeker, and I don't like them freaking out and thinking everything is a huge deal when it's just not. This is all consistent. I'm not having some major mental health crisis that means I need to be IP or something. It's consistent in that it's day in, day out. Sometimes I can distract enough to have a good day or two, but then it all comes crashing back down.

I don't know what I am asking for right now. I know something bad is about to happen and I know there's not a damn thing I can do to stop it. Chucking me IP for a few days wouldn't even stop it; I'd still have to do something when I got out, and it would just mean putting it off a few more days. Telling anybody even if I could won't change it. I'd have to do something worse for telling. Maybe I just want to be heard? or want a hug. something. i don't know.

I'm sorry for wasting space on the board and I'm sorry I have been **** at being supportive.

[when.will.it.end]

I'm in a bit of a state right now so I can't reply properly but I want you to know I read, I care, I can really relate and you're not a waste of space. Hang in there, I'll reply properly when I can <3

[Unbreakable.]

*sends plenty of German hugs*

I know this might sound like a terrible thing to say, but I wanted to say that one year isn't really all that long.
Its too long to be struggling and suffering of course, but if looking at the bigger picture how one year turns out says nothing about how the rest of your life turns out. Things can improve and you got as good a chance as anyone to live a happy life as hard as it might be to believe that right now.

[Auror.]

thanks katie and lana <3

[sherlock holmes]

I know it's really hard for you, but I don't think much will change until you start working through everything with a therapist. I know you feel like you can't talk about things, or if you do you need to hurt yourself, but this is what you can work on in therapy.

What would be worse- feeling like you do now for many more years, or having 6 months of tough therapy but at the end you feel a lot better and able to cope better?

I'm not saying having therapy will be the magic cure, but I think sometimes you have to work through tough things and experience that pain before you can start to move on.

[Auror.]

I know it's really hard for you, but I don't think much will change until you start working through everything with a therapist. I know you feel like you can't talk about things, or if you do you need to hurt yourself, but this is what you can work on in therapy.

What would be worse- feeling like you do now for many more years, or having 6 months of tough therapy but at the end you feel a lot better and able to cope better?

I'm not saying having therapy will be the magic cure, but I think sometimes you have to work through tough things and experience that pain before you can start to move on.

I understand on one level what you are saying but I don't understand how I am supposed to work on talking about things that I literally cannot talk about, or change the fact that I'd have to hurt myself severely if I did if I cannot talk about it. I'm not trying to be rude, I just don't honestly understand what you mean or maybe I am just not reading it right. Sorry.

[sherlock holmes]

It's your belief that you can't talk about things, not that you are physically incapable of doing so. Like I might have the belief that I cannot go outside because when I do I get panic attacks and a racing heart rate. Well, it might be true that those things happen when I go outside, but if I sit inside all the time I'll never get better. In order to be well I have to start going outside with the help of a therapist, and do it in a manageable way. I.e. start off really gently and slowly and build up to going further away from home.

So with the help of a therapist, someone who really understands you, you can take gentle steps to start talking about things, alongside learning distress tolerance skills so you don't hurt yourself severely afterwards.

Does that make it a bit clearer?

[Auror.]

I've learnt distress tolerance before. It's just distraction and coping skills put into fancy words.

You make it sound like I'm just making this up or something. I'm not making it up and it's not just that I don't feel like talking about things or something.

I don't know. Maybe I'm taking it the wrong way. I am struggling to stay safe right now so things are kind of jumbled up.

[when.will.it.end]

Disclaimer I haven't read the whole thread so tell me to shut up if this isn't relevant. I think with talking about stuff it's a fine balance between being distressed talking about hard stuff and being ready and willing. You do definitely need to want to talk about stuff for it to work, and maybe with some things you're just not ready. Doesn't mean there aren't other options

[Auror.]

It's ok, you're fine. But it's not that it's just difficult to talk about. It's that I literally cannot talk about it. It's not that I don't want to. Or that it's just hard. Or that I am unwilling. I don't know how to explain that any better.

[when.will.it.end]

I think I understand what you mean. Do you know what would have to happen for that to change? Would it be the person or something in you, or both? It's ok if you don't know, just brain storming

[Auror.]

I can't think of anything or any situation that would allow it to change. Justin and Tyler found out about it but Justin misinterpreted and Tyler was actually pretty good about it. He was able to find loopholes in the rules or guess things, because he knew I couldn't lie to him. But I've not talked to Tyler since October and I don't know why. He won't answer or return my emails, texts, or voicemails. I've not talked to Justin in going on three weeks now. Part of me almost wants to not do anything just so bad things happen to them and they finally believe me. But I don't think I can do that.

[Auror.]

I don't know what I am doing. I clearly can't do anything right. I emailed the doctor lady just to see if I could schedule an appointment if I changed my mind about things, and this was her response (put under the hide). I don't know if that means I am supposed to say anything to her or not. This is not something she has told me before and the way I am reading it she is saying she has.

She always asks if I want to schedule an appointment, and says that I do not have to. And if she's asking what I want I just get really confused and I don't like feeling pressured to be there, or worrying about having another appointment. Plus I can't afford the copay at this point, to be completely honest. My medicaid doesn't cover the copay because they can only bill my student health insurance, so I still have to pay to go. I don't have a job or income right now, and my savings has gotten to the point where I won't be able to make it more than a couple more months before I have nothing left. I won't be eligible for financial aid and loans until September, assuming I get through my classes this semester and take a fair amount of classes in the summer. So I can get loans and things then, but until then there's nothing I can do.


I guess if I can't do those things there is no point. I just thought it was I am not just supposed to give her name to people at the hospital to get them to let me go, which I don't do. Before she just said only scheduling appointments because I told the doctors in hospital I would was not effective so if I wanted to come that could not be the only reason. Now it's something different. It's always something different.

We had a snow day today so I didn't have to go in to uni, so finally got some sleep. I'm not managing well at all. I'm not doing schoolwork. I'm really not taking care of the dog properly. I'm struggling and I don't think I can keep putting anything off much longer. There's just too much.



To clarify, my second paragraph is consistent with what we've discussed in many of your appointments--treatment is not effective if we don't meet regularly and work toward defined goals. All of my clients schedule regular appointments, meaning once a week in the beginning, or once every other week when we've made gains toward their goals. Each time we end our appointments, you decline to schedule another appointment. This means that each time you leave, we have no sense of when we'll meet again. This virtually guarantees that we can't work, consistently, toward any goals that you have. This is unusual in my experience. As I've shared in the past, it would be unethical if I did not share my concerns about this pattern and how it impacts the effectiveness of our work together.

If we are to continue meeting, it is time for us to be clear about the following:
1) It is necessary to schedule appointments at least every other week
2) It is necessary to have a future appointment scheduled at the conclusion of each visit (i.e. we need to schedule an appointment before you leave your visit with me).
3) It is necessary to have a sense of what we're working on. The goals can be as basic as "develop trusting working relationship." They don't need to be complex, but we do need to know what we're working toward.

Treatment is typically ineffective without these three factors. If we continue to have difficulty coming to an understanding on these three points, it would be best for us to discontinue meeting and for you to explore other resources in the community that might better suit your needs. I would be happy to provide a list of community agencies that you might consider.

I will still send you my availability for next week, but I strongly encourage you to consider if you can meet these three basic necessities. If you would still like to schedule, please let me know what times would work for you.

[Morpheus]

I'd say those are pretty basics in regard of this kind of treatment.

Do you find these requirements unreasonable or is it lack of money that is the problem? Or maybe both? Im not sure i understand exactly what it is you are saying but would like to.

Personally ive had these kinds of agreements in every type of therapy ive had. Being consistant in showing up and in case it becomes a problem for whatever reason, discuss it and find a solution that works.

Having goals and reviewing how its going along the way and setting new goals when one is reached is also a normal requirement.

I agree that these things are basic and needs to be in place for the treatment to be effective as she says. Ive never experienced to not have agreements like that (sometimes even more agreements for me to get the treatment) from the start, no matter whether it was treatment in the mental health sector here or the private treatment ive had and it makes sense to me.

It seems she wants to help and believe she can but it is true that it also require you to do something and make clear deals and agreements with her that you follow. I think she seems understanding from how i read it but i do understand how it can be a problem financially and maybe you need to discuss that with her and see if, together, you can find a solution where the treatment can still be effective and you are able to cope financially with it.

It is of course not going yo be easy to challenge your beliefs, behaviors etc. But perhaps fir now, finding a solution on how to get the help and how it can work fir both you and her is most important. Then after that face the difficulties of talking little by little and challenge the belief of it being impossible to talk or certain things will happen and how to manage the risks that may occur after you have opened up. That should be in place beforehand as well.

If is your choice though whether you can talk or not. Not an easy choice but yours still. It is also your choice whether to harm yourself and again s difficult one if you believe something horrible will happen if you dont. But you only get better if you do this snd challenge it and by that learn that it is not necessarily true what you are so convinced of. I do understand that it is in no way easy and that it will cause major anxiety and triggers however how to handle those things is also something to find out with her if you agree to the treatment.

However it is clear from her email that she is not expecting you to just be able to open up and tell everything within an hour. She does need to feel thst you want this snd is trying and challenging things, even though its hard and scary. She needs to feel that you want this and is willing to do what is necessary for you to get better but not all at once.

It is not unusual for therapists/psycholigists etc. To have a few demands and from what i have experienced, hers seem very readonable and fair in comparison.

[Auror.]

If it's so basic why is she only now saying it is something I have to agree to? Every time I turn around there's something new that I'm not doing right or that I have to agree to.

I don't think it's necessarily unreasonable but I don't think given what I have told her about scheduling things that it is ok to expect that. Especially given she has always said she does not want me to feel pressured or like I have to come. Now she's contradicting herself.

Plus financially yes it's an issue. It's 14 dollars to see her, and that means using the money that my mom gives me which I am supposed to use for things like food and gas on that. Doing that every week would be a decent chunk of that money.

It's just weird because she said at first I could not email her about things but now she seems okay with me emailing her questions or to schedule things. I think she has realised I do not talk on the phone. I have told her that multiple times. You are supposed to call on the phone when you arrive for an appointment and I do not. Justin did the first few times until he refused and I did not do it so she just comes out to check to see if I am there because otherwise she knows I would sit there and wait the entire time and not call.

I want to ask her why she is saying this is an issue now when it was not an issue before because it is contradictory but I feel like that would be rude to ask.

[Iamcatbug]

It could be that she was waiting for you to feel comfortable enough to schedule regular appointments with her in your own time and that she may now just be trying to see if you need encouraging to see Her more regularly.

She could also be looking at this all from a financial point which does suck, but it is possible that there are people waiting for her support that she can't take on due to patients that aren't making appointments. Not that I am saying this is your fault at all, just that often of patients aren't seen to engage activley they tend to want to offer the treatment to others.

I have to agree with Morpheus, what she had said in her email to you is pretty standard for things like this. And there does come a time when they have to act. She could be seeing it as you not wanting the help etc.


Would it be possible to explain any of what you have said here to her?

[Auror.]

If she thinks I do not want help then that is contradictory to what she said the last time I was there.

I am unsure what I would explain? What were you referring to?

[Iamcatbug]

That you don't understand why she is suddenly saying this. How you can't talk about things but that you need support. And everything else you mentioned in your first post.

[Auror.]

I think maybe I could ask why she is suddenly saying this in email but the rest of the stuff would probably require making an appointment. She already knows that there are things I am not allowed to talk about.

I am afraid of saying something though because it is contradictory and the last time I told her that something she said contradicting something else she said she told me I must have misunderstood and that it was not contradictory.

[Snow White.]

What makes you think she is saying you don't want help (and is that the thing that you feel is contradictory as previously she's acknowledged you have)?

Short reply I'm afraid - at placement. Will reply properly when I'm home x

[Auror.]

The not wanting help thing was something Cat said, and if that were true (which doctor lady did not say or write in the email) then that is contradictory to what she said when I was there the last time.

She has always said when I am there that she will always ask at the end of an appointment if I want to schedule another one, but that it is okay to say no or to not schedule one and then schedule one later if I change my mind. She said she does not want me to feel like I am required to be there or feel pressured to be there. But the email now contradicts that, at least in my opinion.

[Auror.]

and now i just got an email that all the groups in one of my classes have been moved around, which means given by my new group number i will be sitting in the back of the class. i can't focus in the back of the class. at all. i understanding wanting people to work in groups but i don't know how am i going to be able to focus if i cannot sit someplace where i can actually pay attention and i am sure i am probably panicking over something stupid so it's not actually worth emailing the professor.

and i am so behind in everything anyways. i haven't done much of anything today because i can't handle it. and i am aware just sticking my head in the sand and ignoring it won't make it go away but i am trying to stay safe so i don't know what else to do?

[Auror.]

Pretty sure I can't just apologise to professors for not doing work and say that I was busy trying not to end up dead. Counted the pills I have and it is more than I thought so would be enough to actually likely kill me. But that is not how it is supposed to be but I can't do how it is supposed to be because that would be scary and involve other bad things and I want it to stop. I'm scared.

[sherlock holmes]

I know how scary it feels to be in the middle of uni work, to be behind and on top of that to feel utterly depressed and hopeless and like things can never change.

But we're all on the outside of your situation, so we can see things objectively. I can see you battling between wanting to get better and wanting to die. And your core belief that you can't talk about things with a therapist is the main hindrance to your recovery, because it makes you think nothing can possibly get better.

Morpheus said everything I was trying to say in a better way. Your therapist's email makes a lot of sense, if you meet her regularly with goals to work towards then you will start to make progress even if you go at a snails pace.

If you're at this point of being suicidal and in crisis, then clearly you don't have anything to lose now. You're at the bottom and so the only way is up. So why not just give it a try? Do what your therapist says? Plus if your mum knew how desperate you felt then I'm sure she'd give you the $14 a week for therapy, because that's nothing in comparison to her daughter being dead.

I know how overwhelming it all feels. But it doesn't have to be this way and you CAN change it.

Can you use some coping skills right now to deal with the thoughts? Have you done DBT skills? When I have bad suicidal urges and they scare the **** out of me I remind myself that nothing bad can happen to me without me acting on those thoughts. My arms wont just independently cause me harm, and so it boils down to me just not acting on them. At times that feels like a big ask, but then I remember that urges come and go in waves. If you 'sit with' the urges and thoughts then they will come to a peak and then recede- and then you learn that nothing bad happens if you don't act on them!

[Snow White.]

I think what I'm going to say is a bit similar to Anna, but let's see if I can explain myself clearly.

What would happen if you did an experiment where you talked about the things you're "not allowed to" and see what happens? Right now you believe so strongly that bad things will happen if you do, but you don't have any evidence.

It's like how I believe eating certain foods will make me sick. If I don't eat the foods I can never disprove the belief and it gets stronger. But if I eat the food and don't get sick I have some evidence that my beliefs were not justified.

Doesn't mean you're just making it up, doesn't mean you don't feel extreme distress at this idea.

Does that makes sense?

Obviously it's super anxiety provoking so best worked on with your dr lady but it's a new approach- your current approach isn't working cause things are still so hard.

Also I would recommend not telling her about the contradiction you see about her thinking you want help. To me she is being very supportive and willing to work with you but just asking for some regularity. It's worth considering.

I know she said you didn't need to make appointments at the end of sessions and this email says differently, I wouldn't bring it up as a contradiction but instead I suggest she's been thinking about how best to help you and realised this is it and so she's changed her mind. She mentions her ethical duty to do her best to support you and she's right that the regular appointments would be better for that, for goal setting, maybe even for you knowing when you can see her next.

I hope you're doing ok xxx

[Auror.]

I know how scary it feels to be in the middle of uni work, to be behind and on top of that to feel utterly depressed and hopeless and like things can never change.

But we're all on the outside of your situation, so we can see things objectively. I can see you battling between wanting to get better and wanting to die. And your core belief that you can't talk about things with a therapist is the main hindrance to your recovery, because it makes you think nothing can possibly get better.

Morpheus said everything I was trying to say in a better way. Your therapist's email makes a lot of sense, if you meet her regularly with goals to work towards then you will start to make progress even if you go at a snails pace.

If you're at this point of being suicidal and in crisis, then clearly you don't have anything to lose now. You're at the bottom and so the only way is up. So why not just give it a try? Do what your therapist says? Plus if your mum knew how desperate you felt then I'm sure she'd give you the $14 a week for therapy, because that's nothing in comparison to her daughter being dead.

I know how overwhelming it all feels. But it doesn't have to be this way and you CAN change it.

Can you use some coping skills right now to deal with the thoughts? Have you done DBT skills? When I have bad suicidal urges and they scare the **** out of me I remind myself that nothing bad can happen to me without me acting on those thoughts. My arms wont just independently cause me harm, and so it boils down to me just not acting on them. At times that feels like a big ask, but then I remember that urges come and go in waves. If you 'sit with' the urges and thoughts then they will come to a peak and then recede- and then you learn that nothing bad happens if you don't act on them!

I don't feel depressed and I don't want to die. That's not what I want. I don't know how to explain it properly I guess. I've done a bit of DBT but never found it terribly helpful. And telling my mother what is going on is not an option. Nor do I feel like I'm in crisis. If I were then it'd mean I am pretty much always in crisis. I'm being negative. Should probably shut up.

[Snow White.]

I don't think you should shut up, I think it's actually really important you keep talking here.

[Auror.]

I think what I'm going to say is a bit similar to Anna, but let's see if I can explain myself clearly.

What would happen if you did an experiment where you talked about the things you're "not allowed to" and see what happens? Right now you believe so strongly that bad things will happen if you do, but you don't have any evidence.

It's like how I believe eating certain foods will make me sick. If I don't eat the foods I can never disprove the belief and it gets stronger. But if I eat the food and don't get sick I have some evidence that my beliefs were not justified.

Doesn't mean you're just making it up, doesn't mean you don't feel extreme distress at this idea.

Does that makes sense?

Obviously it's super anxiety provoking so best worked on with your dr lady but it's a new approach- your current approach isn't working cause things are still so hard.

Also I would recommend not telling her about the contradiction you see about her thinking you want help. To me she is being very supportive and willing to work with you but just asking for some regularity. It's worth considering.

I know she said you didn't need to make appointments at the end of sessions and this email says differently, I wouldn't bring it up as a contradiction but instead I suggest she's been thinking about how best to help you and realised this is it and so she's changed her mind. She mentions her ethical duty to do her best to support you and she's right that the regular appointments would be better for that, for goal setting, maybe even for you knowing when you can see her next.

I hope you're doing ok xxx

What happens if/when I said something and then had to do bad things? Then that doesn't disprove it.

And I have told her before I am not even supposed to be there so even just physically being there is hard. I don't know. As I said. Being negative right now I think.

I don't know if she was meant to email me back or if I am to email her. But uni was closed again today/yesterday/Tuesday so if she was meant to email me about scheduling she would not have been able to.

It's after 4am. Sleep is a thing that is not happening clearly. I just talked to one of my group mates to try to finish an assignment due tomorrow so that was ok I guess. She seems very nice. We made plans to finish it before class tomorrow/today, unless there is a snow day, which, given it's snowed an inch since I got home 3 hours ago is possible.

I am really really trying to not do anything because if I needed medical attention and the weather is this bad I would feel even more guilty for wasting resources.

[Snow White.]

What happens if/when I said something and then had to do bad things? Then that doesn't disprove it.

What makes you 'have' to do bad things? I think that is the idea that trying to be talked about here - what if you didn't do the bad things even if you felt you had to. Yes there would be a great deal of anxiety but that is what the therapy could work on. Of course I'm talking over time here, it's a long process of changing tings like this.

Is there any way you could try and get sleep now? If not, maybe plan some of the work for tomorrow to keep you occupied instead of hurting yourself?

[Auror.]

It goes against other things in place that I do not get a say in.

I am unsure I can go to sleep now. I have to be up in 3-4 hours at this point anyways if I am meeting my group mate. I'm already essentially useless because I'm so exhausted.

[Snow White.]

Would a small rest help you to feel less exhausted, if possible for you to do?

What if you didn't listen to that thing that you don't get a say in, and see what happens?

You've got around these rules before with Justin?

[Auror.]

I don't know. Once i finally manage to fall asleep I have a hard time getting up. So I am afraid I would not get up to go to uni as it has not closed yet.

Justin forced me to tell him. I didn't get around it. Not listening to it isn't an option. I can barely do enough to hold things off as is. If I did something to make it worse there's no way.

[Morpheus]

Okay. Im just going to comment in the financial part right now as i feel i have said what i think and can suggest and what in my own experience has helped in similar situation, in previous threads of yours. You are welcome to read through those replies if interested.

I was thinking, she didnt say every week but every other week. How i see it that means at least twice a month. You said it was 14 dollars each time i think? Thats a dollar a day, more or less. Could you put that aside each day and save in a box for these appointments? Even if it has to go from other things like food. Can you find cheaper options regarding food that allows you to be able to do that.

I understand how it is not an ideal situation and that it is tough but maybe see this as an investment in you, on an equal with food? Because what does it matter that you can afford food if you have died from an OD. Right now you are stuck in a hard and unmanageble situation for you and something needs to be done. As i see it, this is likely the way forward.

If you cant do that, is it possible for you to tell your mother a white lie basically. Tell her that the food for money isnt quite enough and a bit more would do wonders for you? And hope that she may help you. Even if she doesnt give you the specific amout, just a little could help in regards of finding the money.

Perhaps look through where you can save. Like is there a cheaper shampoo option, could you make food and freeze and reheat in a cheap way, can you save a bit on transport etc.

I had to do that when my back got really bad and i suddenly had to go from not having to pay for any medications to suddenly have to pay about £100 a month that i hadnt budgedet after when i moved and having to buy a lot of things to help me around the flat. Its tough and that as well went from a few hobbies, food, other things i needed in every day life. But starting to look for cheaper options whenever i went shopping, to make different priorities etc. And stuff like that made it possible. Not easy, but possible. So perhaps its worth a try to put the money to see her aside and see if its possible to manage financially without them if you change some things. Maybe have a trial period for a month to see whether its possible.

Just a few suggestions as i think it could really make a positive difference for you to see her regularly.

[Snow White.]

Can you explain what you have to hold off, when you say "I can barely do enough to hold things off"?

I hope you're doing okay, not sure if you've met up to study yet but take it easy x

[Auror.]

I got halfway to uni. Got my car stuck on a hill because there's no way to get there that doesn't involve going up a huge hill. Made it home to find that fifteen minutes after I left the professor extended the assignment until Friday, and that as soon as I made I made it back home, the entire uni closed.

I might just try to go back to sleep. I don't know. The roads are terrible, so I don't want to have to go back out after that. Now that I'm home I feel really unsafe and just really odd physically. I don't know if it's just lack of sleep or what.

It's taking all I have to not self harm or od. I don't think I could keep it manageable. Pills are just sitting on the kitchen counter because I'm supposed to have od'd again already but I can't do that when the weather is so bad even if I am meant to be dead because I don't want people to deal with it. I am confused.

[Auror.]

Okay. Im just going to comment in the financial part right now as i feel i have said what i think and can suggest and what in my own experience has helped in similar situation, in previous threads of yours. You are welcome to read through those replies if interested.

I was thinking, she didnt say every week but every other week. How i see it that means at least twice a month. You said it was 14 dollars each time i think? Thats a dollar a day, more or less. Could you put that aside each day and save in a box for these appointments? Even if it has to go from other things like food. Can you find cheaper options regarding food that allows you to be able to do that.

I understand how it is not an ideal situation and that it is tough but maybe see this as an investment in you, on an equal with food? Because what does it matter that you can afford food if you have died from an OD. Right now you are stuck in a hard and unmanageble situation for you and something needs to be done. As i see it, this is likely the way forward.

If you cant do that, is it possible for you to tell your mother a white lie basically. Tell her that the food for money isnt quite enough and a bit more would do wonders for you? And hope that she may help you. Even if she doesnt give you the specific amout, just a little could help in regards of finding the money.

Perhaps look through where you can save. Like is there a cheaper shampoo option, could you make food and freeze and reheat in a cheap way, can you save a bit on transport etc.

I had to do that when my back got really bad and i suddenly had to go from not having to pay for any medications to suddenly have to pay about £100 a month that i hadnt budgedet after when i moved and having to buy a lot of things to help me around the flat. Its tough and that as well went from a few hobbies, food, other things i needed in every day life. But starting to look for cheaper options whenever i went shopping, to make different priorities etc. And stuff like that made it possible. Not easy, but possible. So perhaps its worth a try to put the money to see her aside and see if its possible to manage financially without them if you change some things. Maybe have a trial period for a month to see whether its possible.

Just a few suggestions as i think it could really make a positive difference for you to see her regularly.

The only things I buy that I don't have to have are coffee and occasionally I will go out for a meal. If it were only a matter of a few dollars here or there I could make it work but the reality is I am at least two to three hundred dollars short every month in paying my bills. I've been using my savings which is almost gone.

[Auror.]

I should win some kind of stupidity award. I emailed doctor lady and said that I was confused because I do nt remember those things being requirements and financially as well as otherwise that would be an issue. I also declined her list of community resources because she's given it to me before and they don't know what to do with me either because they don't understand self harm or eating things and I'm not homeless or addicted to drugs or alcohol.

I'm just going to hide in bed and pretend none of this is happening. Not safe.

edit: And now I'm apparently starting a job on Tuesday? I have no idea. The lady asked me to email her if I was still interested, so I emailed thinking I'd get set up for an interview in a few weeks, and instead it was, call this number in the morning and you will start Tuesday. Um. I kind of have the feeling I am not functional enough for a job but I really really need the money so I don't know?

[Snow White.]

Hi Carmen im just wondering how you're doing? Sorry I havent replied to your post above. It's late here but I'll be back to give it the reply it deserves, until then I'm wondering how you're doing today?

[Snow White.]

Can you tell me a bit more how you feel about the job? And how you would cope with it?

[Bellatrix]

Just wanted to leave some love and hugs for you. Sorry I don't have advice x

[Auror.]

Hi Carmen im just wondering how you're doing? Sorry I havent replied to your post above. It's late here but I'll be back to give it the reply it deserves, until then I'm wondering how you're doing today?

Thank you lovely. I dunno. I haven't been up long and it's snowing again so stuck at home. Should try to get some schoolwork done. The roads are terrible so going out really isn't an option and so obviously if I did anything I would not be able to call for help.

Can you tell me a bit more how you feel about the job? And how you would cope with it?

I don't know. I don't really even know anything about it. I'm supposed to go Monday after class to fill out paperwork then orientation is on Tuesday. My mother has a friend who owns a temp agency, so she got me in with them and got me the job. I'm barely managing to cope with things as is, and attending class is still a struggle. I don't know how I'm going to be able to manage a job on top. Honestly don't. But I really really need the money.

Just wanted to leave some love and hugs for you. Sorry I don't have advice x

Thank you, J. It means a lot. <3


edit: Never heard from doctor lady even though uni was open Friday so I'm assuming I am just not seeing her again. I know it's my own fault, I'm not saying it's not. I take full responsibility for that. But it still sucks.

[Snow White.]

Is there another way you could get some money or financial support? What about your parents or whatever benefits you might be entitled to?

I agree working is going to add extra pressure to you right now and that is one thing you don't need.

Regarding doctor lady, did you want to see her again with her conditions of regular attendance?

[Auror.]

I'm ineligible for financial aid through uni right now. To be eligible for next year (which would essentially happen in September) I need to finish and pass all my courses this semester, and then take 16 credit hours over the summer. My mother supposedly helps me as much as she can (though this is debatable, given how much money she already gives me I can't really ask for more) and my father's financial situation is worse than mine. I get medicaid which covers my hospital bills, but I don't think I would be eligible for anything else given I am a student, and I don't have a disability.

My mother has already told me if the job doesn't work out it's not a big deal, but the problem is it's still going to be a big deal financially. I have a couple of thousand dollars from my tax return that has to get me through until September, and I currently spend at least 400$ a month on bills after her help.

I don't think I can go every week like she wants, even if I could afford it. I don't understand why that had to be a thing. So it's irrelevant I guess.

[youonlyliveonce]

I think she wants you to try and go every week so she can build up the connection to be able to trust enough to talk about the difficult stuff

Use a sports analogy if players only turned up when they wanted due to whatever reason how would they bond as a team and win games

Or like medication if you didn't take as perscribed n only on odd occassion you wouldn't feel benefits day to day or when in crisis but if you take it consistently you will see improvements gradually

Is there a financial advisor you could see in or outside of uni we had a hardship fund people could tap into to or outside you might be entitled to discounts or grants


Just a thought hope the job goes well

[Auror.]

I know why she was saying it. She explained. I don't know why she was contradicting herself because that is NOT how she said it had to be previously.

I know what my options are with regards to uni. I don't qualify for aid as is. I know what I need to do to qualify, as I have already said, but it won't do anything until September.

Outside of uni there are loans through a bank but most require you be eligible for government aid, and it doesn't make sense to try to find one who doesn't to take out a loan for a few months when I am going to be eligible for financial aid which gives you better and more options later on.

Thanks.

[Snow White.]

Does your mum know you need more financial help? It doesn't have to be permanent but just to get you through this tough patch.

[Auror.]

She knows. She's told me to take out loans. After telling me she made more money in a month than her highest paid employee will make all year. So I'm getting mixed messages from her but she is well aware.

[Auror.]

Start new job tomorrow. Didn't make it to class today but made it to the job agency to fill out paperwork.

Really struggling to stay safe so even if anyone can spare some hugs it would be very very much appreciated.

[look out a piano]

*Hugs* Take care Carmen

[chinahorse]

*huggles*

would a plan of how to spend the rest of the day help? (I have 0 idea on your timezone)

[Auror.]

thank you, look out a piano.

lillie thanks <33, it's not quite 7pm here. i dunno if plans help or not because then i will get stressed if i can't keep to it, and sleep at a reasonable hour is unlikely anyways which the later it gets the more likely i will be to do something, and less likely to be functional enough to follow a plan. if that makes sense?

so far I have:
attempt some schoolwork
feed the dog and take her outside
and that's it.

[chinahorse]

what about a nice hot beverage time and a doogy cuddles time? some quiet nice things you enjoy?

[Auror.]

I feel like I shouldn't be doing things like that right now when I am so behind on schoolwork.

[chinahorse]

Ok so maybe do schoolwork, nice thing, school work, nice thing. Short bursts of school work are always more achieveable.

[Auror.]

I am unsure how to break any of it down into smaller chunks. Or manage time well enough to where I could do that and not just have three hours of doing nothing go by. I'm not good at this. Sorry.

there's just too much to do and it's all completely overwhelming.

edit: I fail at schoolwork. I tried to do a discussion board post and didn't know what to say. Tried to read and I can't focus. I can't take notes because focus either. So now I'm just sitting here and have no idea what to do with myself.

[Auror.]

I have an assignment due tonight that I have not done and orientation for the new job in a couple of hours. I need to get ready to leave soon and I have zero idea what business casual means and nothing that I would be comfortable with wearing so oh well.

I emailed doctor lady because I wanted to know my diagnosis and what my notes said. This was her response:
If you would like to review your full chart notes from our visits, I would strongly encourage that we review them together so you have the opportunity to ask questions or clarify information and we can have a conversation about that. I am not at liberty to release records from other providers. I would be happy to schedule a time for us to sit down and for you to review your records without charge, as a courtesy to you. If you do not wish to meet to review your records, I will consult with my director about how you can go about requesting your records. I believe our policies have changed and a 3rd party now handles patient request for records.

As for your question about diagnosis, my most recent diagnostic impression includes: major depression, anxiety disorder, rule-out eating disorder, and borderline personality disorder. I feel these diagnoses accurately capture the symptoms that I can identify in our work together. I would suspect that anxiety plays a stronger role than depression. The borderline personality disorder captures your self-harm behaviors, as well as the persistent difficulties in relationships with others (i.e. difficulties with trust, difficulties feeling secure in relationships).



I asked what "rule out eating disorder meant" and said I did want to see my notes and then this was her next response:


Rule out eating disorder means I suspect there is some kind of eating disorder, but I can't be sure that you do or do not meet the criteria for an eating disorder. It's a way to indicate concern and that I would want to keep that on the radar for myself or future care providers if they had access to your records through our system.

You can just come directly to the waiting room where I usually pick you up without having to check in. We can meet for up to 90 minutes if necessary, and I will have your records ready so we can get started promptly.


I am kind of frustrated with the diagnosis but I do want to see my notes so I am going to meet with her tomorrow. But I am unsure quite how to act around her because of all of this.

[Auror.]

well.

she did admit diagnosis could be wrong because there is still a lot of information she does not know.

apparently i am severely ill. and her main recommendation at this time is intensive long term inpatient treatment. but that because i refuse to engage in treatment or trust professionals and i am skilled at talking my way out of hospital it would never work. and that unless i agree to see her on a weekly or biweekly basis and make progress i cannot use their services again.

she is letting me keep the notes so i will get them later this week. but i think those are shitty things to say about a person even in writing.

i'm a ****ing horrible person. it's clear.

[sherlock holmes]

I don't think they are shitty things and you're not a horrible person. To use a cliche, if you read that you had a broken leg, or a heart condition, would you think you were a horrible person because of it, or that they were **** things to say about someone?

You're ill, but it doesn't make you any less of a person that it's a mental health issue.

I can only imagine how scary/frustrating it is to be told that unless you engage they wont see you any more. That's one way of looking at it (I think it's very easy to see things in black and white) whereas if you look at the grey then really your therapist is 1) Very concerned about you, and 2) Wanting to help you through this how she believes is the best way with your diagnoses, which means being seen weekly and possibly having long term treatment.

I know you thought I was being harsh last time, and I really wasn't intending to be. I see this as a fork in the road, and one way is the treatment way and yes it will be hard but ultimately you will feel better and be able to cope and function. The other way is retreating from therapy, not engaging, and really while it probably seems easier right now, ultimately things won't change.

I don't want to sound patronising, but I've been where you are. I had the same diagnoses as you, similar struggles. And after years of not engaging because either I didn't want to recover, or it was simply too hard to try I'd literally had enough. So I engaged. I did what they said. And yes it was hard and I hated it at first, but slowly things got better and better until I started to come out of the deep hole I'd been in for years. And now I don't even have the BPD diagnosis.

Of course she doesn't expect you to trust her 100% right now and to speak about everything in your first session. Trust is built up, and as I said before, the reasons why you feel you can't talk about things can start to be looked at and she will help you start to break those barriers down in a safe way.

But you're definitely not a horrible person. I think you're scared, which is understandable, use that fear to move forwards.

[Auror.]

I got the notes to keep today and have reread them.

I don't understand why she gave me so much **** about having a hard time trusting her and engaging, and then in all of her notes she puts that she doesn't think I will be able to. So if she had no hope either, it is okay for her to think that but not me?

[Snow White.]

Did you ask Her about that?
I'm not sure it means she had no hope, but you're pretty vocal about not being able to share information perhaps she feels it's because of a trust thing so wrote it that way?

[Snow White.]

But you're definitely not a horrible person. I think you're scared, which is understandable, use that fear to move forwards.



I think this is a good point too x

[Auror.]

Did you ask Her about that?
I'm not sure it means she had no hope, but you're pretty vocal about not being able to share information perhaps she feels it's because of a trust thing so wrote it that way?

I did not because I can't think of a polite way to ask that or any of the other questions that I have and did not ask.


I think this is a good point too x

I never said I was scared. I really wish people would stop making assumptions.

[Auror.]

This is pretty much the majority of what the notes say. How should that NOT make me feel like a horrible person?

"not a good candidate for treatment at this time"


"She has significant lack of trust for doctors and is a help seeker/rejector in that she will raise alarm in others and seek their help, but then reject what is offered to her."


"She is not at imminent risk of self-harm, but has a long-term history of non-suicidal self-injury, eating disorder, depression, and borderline personality disorder which increase her long-term risk of self-harm.
…
Continue to consider formal discharge from this clinic as patient is high risk for self-harm (low imminence, high risk long term), but unable to engage in therapy at this time.”


OH and let’s not forget. My favourite….
"very ill young woman … and is familiar with what she has to say and do to avoid the consequences of her behaviours. She would benefit most from long term, intensive inpatient therapy to target her eating disorder and self-harm behaviours. It is unlikely that she would agree to participate in this type of treatment, given her baseline belief that she is not able to be helped. Despite earnest attempts at building a relationship with this client, she remained distrustful and unable to form a stable working relationship."

And on the scale of Problem severity for both borderline and anxiety, I was ranked as severe which is the highest ranking.

[Snow White.]

I know it must be hard reading those things about yourself, but they sound like a reflection of your engagement in therapy and not you as a person. Your treatment has been impacted by the fact you can't speak about things.

Do you consider yourself a good candidate for treatment right now?

I'm sure you've expressed a distrust of doctors before?

I know it must be hard but none of what I read there makes me think you're a bad person. Obviously I'm looking from the outside in and I can appreciate it would be hard to read and why it has left you feeling so bad.

Out of curiosity why did you request your notes? Sorry if I missed the answer earlier.

What is happening with that job you just got?

[Snow White.]

And, importantly your engagement has been impacted by your illness not you as a person just being difficult. The same sort of thing "unable to engage now" could be said by a physiotherapist if their client had a broken arm and couldn't do the exercises, the arm needs to heal to be ready for the work like you need to be in a headspace ready for the therapy.

I guess that's how I see it as not "you're a horrible person" but instead you're unwell and it's impacting the therapy.

I am sorry to hear how upset you are by the notes though, maybe you could put them away for a bit?

[Auror.]

I know it must be hard reading those things about yourself, but they sound like a reflection of your engagement in therapy and not you as a person. Your treatment has been impacted by the fact you can't speak about things.

Do you consider yourself a good candidate for treatment right now?

I'm sure you've expressed a distrust of doctors before?

I know it must be hard but none of what I read there makes me think you're a bad person. Obviously I'm looking from the outside in and I can appreciate it would be hard to read and why it has left you feeling so bad.

Out of curiosity why did you request your notes? Sorry if I missed the answer earlier.

What is happening with that job you just got?

I am always distrustful of doctors; this is nothing new, and she was aware of it from the start. I guess I would have no idea what makes someone a good candidate for treatment versus not, because it frustrates me when she says well I need to participate and act a certain way in therapy but then obviously if I don't, I have no idea how to do that.

I requested my notes because for one thing I wanted to see what she said, if she actually believed me about things, and I don't trust her so I wanted to see what she puts in because other people could see it.

I went to the job; it's honestly horrible. The people there seem nice but I can't sit there and talk on the phone, and I get really overwhelmed and can't focus very well when someone else next to me is saying the same things on the phone that I am meant to be saying but is often at a different place. But my mom got me the job through a friend, so I have to go. Plus my mom watches the dog for me while I am there because it is 5 minutes from her house. And I obviously really need the money.

And, importantly your engagement has been impacted by your illness not you as a person just being difficult. The same sort of thing "unable to engage now" could be said by a physiotherapist if their client had a broken arm and couldn't do the exercises, the arm needs to heal to be ready for the work like you need to be in a headspace ready for the therapy.

I guess that's how I see it as not "you're a horrible person" but instead you're unwell and it's impacting the therapy.

I am sorry to hear how upset you are by the notes though, maybe you could put them away for a bit?

Well it seems she thinks I am being difficult on purpose even when I do try from how I am reading that. Which again is frustrating to always be told I'm not trying or engaging when I am trying my best. I do get what you're saying but I'm not doing a very good job rationalizing it right now I guess. It doesn't mean I don't appreciate it.

I've set them aside now that I have read through them again a few times. I'm attempting to do some schoolwork but struggling with it. But we have a field trip on Sunday that I am looking forward to, and someone is coming in from another university on Monday to talk about their work on the Mars Rover, so I am really trying to stay safe because both of those things sound nice.

Pretty sure I can't tell professors that I have not come to class or done work because I'm busy not trying to end up in the hospital or dead. I missed a quiz and multiple lectures this week. Today was the only day I managed to get to class. Plus now that I have to go to work, I can't rationalize attempting to go to class and then being able to come home and calm down, because I can't. So now I'm going to have to put going to work over going to class which is only going to make my class attendance worse.

[Auror.]

i am so sorry for bumping again. i keep doing this and then apologising.

i went out today on the field trip with my class in horrible weather conditions (rain or snow the entire day) and drove the twelve passenger van.

i just have no idea how i can be told i'm severely ill one minute and then be perfectly functional the next. okay so there was some panicking when we had to take a ferry but that's i think normal for a new experience when you are terrified of crossing water? it makes zero sense and i'm so frustrated by it all.

i have three tests and a quiz this week on top of regular assignments and i'm already feeling really overwhelmed. i need to not do anything.

[chinahorse]

Really well done on driving the van in such horrible conditions, don't envy you that one.

To be aprehensive of something new is totally understadable.

Would it help to make a plan of your revision time and break the work down into manageable chunks with frequent rewards?

<3

[Auror.]

I am unsure. I know the limited times I will have this week to work on things- which sucks because the main time I would normally have is now taken up by having to work. And I don't want to make a plan to get things done than not be able to because I don't feel up to it or something and then feel like even more of a failure. I have a list of things I need to do and it's really long and I tend to do work for my easier to manage classes first, which means I do stuff in classes that I am already caught up on and get further and further behind in the others. oops lol.