Isnt this fabulous news :)
I'm not gay but I think this is deifinatly a step in the right direction :)
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Enlarge PhotoThousands of people march in 2002, during the annual London's Mardi Gras Pride parade.
The government has drawn up plans to introduce same-sex civil marriages before the next election in 2015, Equalities Minister Lynne Featherstone said Saturday.
"I am delighted to announce today that in March, this government will begin a formal consultation on how to implement equal civil marriage for same-sex couples," she told her Liberal Democrat party's annual conference in Birmingham.
"And this would allow us to make any legislative changes necessary by the end of this parliament."
Civil partnerships for same-sex couples were introduced in Britain in December 2005, giving them similar rights to married heterosexual couples. However, the partnerships cannot legally be referred to as marriages.
"I believe that to deny one group of people the same opportunities offered to another is not only discrimination, but is not fair," Featherstone said.
The change is expected to win strong support among the Liberal Democrats, the junior partners in Conservative Prime Minister David Cameron's coalition.
But while Cameron is also said to back the plans, he could face opposition from traditionalist Conservatives, who believe marriage should only be between a man and a woman.
Gay rights groups argue that maintaining a separation between marriage and civil partnerships perpetuates the notion that same-sex relationships are not as valid as those involving heterosexual couples.
Although activists welcomed the new proposals, they questioned the delay in the consultation until March.
Rights campaigner Peter Tatchell said: "I am not convinced that there needs to be any consultation at all. The ban on same-sex marriage is homophobic discrimination and should be repealed
Good, and to those who moan about it... if you don't like it don't get one. Stop being a bunch of nosey curtain twitchers.
20 years from now people will be asking why were people so backwards in 2011, why weren't gay people allowed to get married if they loved each other?
Some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money.
They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned or negotiated with.
Some men just want to watch the world burn.
Step in the wrong direction. No marriage should be legal, homosexual or otherwise.
Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.
― United Nations, Universal Declaration of Human Rights
I think far too many people feel so compelled to cause everyone to believe the same way they do that they misunderstand or ignore what freedom is. I consider myself to be conservative in my PERSONAL morals and beliefs. For the life of me I can't understand how a man can be attracted to another man or a woman attracted to another woman. Personally I feel that being gay is wrong, but who am I or anyone else to pass laws in an attempt to dictate someones personal freedoms? The fact of the matter is that if Bob marries Steve or Cindy marries Katy, it doesn't limit another's freedom, but passing a law to prevent them from getting married does limit their freedom.
Do I applaud same sex marriage? No I don't, but I do applaud the individual freedom that not defining a marriage law as man and woman provides.
Although I am conservative in my own PERSONAL morals I am a hardcore Libertarian when it comes to individual freedom. It's a slippery slope when government starts creating laws governing the moral actions of a free people.
There's a moral hypocrisy within the majority of anti-gay marriage activists. Cheating on a spouse is immoral, but I don't hear anything about the anti-gay marriage crowd protesting at a cheaters home. Gluttony is also considered by many to be immoral, again there aren't any protests outside an over eating gluttons home. It's because of a moral hypocrisy.
More often then not the anti-gay marriage crowd base their beliefs off of religion. There's absolutely nothing wrong with having a moral code that tell you that gay marriage is wrong, but what is wrong is when you try to force your moral code on the rest of society.
I have a question for anyone who wants to create laws to dictate a moral code such as limiting marriage to man and woman. If we as a people don't have the freedom and choice to live our own moral code, and our actions and morality is dictated through government as opposed to personal convictions and faith, what purpose would there then be for religion?
God doesn't make us live a certain way. God may require it, but the choice is ours. If God gave us choice, what gives us the right to limit another's choice?
Good, and to those who moan about it... if you don't like it don't get one. Stop being a bunch of nosey curtain twitchers.
20 years from now people will be asking why were people so backwards in 2011, why weren't gay people allowed to get married if they loved each other?
QFT
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Originally Posted by Ragaholic
Step in the wrong direction. No marriage should be legal, homosexual or otherwise.
Can I ask why? Genuinely curious.
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Originally Posted by Jaime*Is*Broken
I think far too many people feel so compelled to cause everyone to believe the same way they do that they misunderstand or ignore what freedom is. I consider myself to be conservative in my PERSONAL morals and beliefs. For the life of me I can't understand how a man can be attracted to another man or a woman attracted to another woman. Personally I feel that being gay is wrong, but who am I or anyone else to pass laws in an attempt to dictate someones personal freedoms? The fact of the matter is that if Bob marries Steve or Cindy marries Katy, it doesn't limit another's freedom, but passing a law to prevent them from getting married does limit their freedom.
Do I applaud same sex marriage? No I don't, but I do applaud the individual freedom that not defining a marriage law as man and woman provides.
Although I am conservative in my own PERSONAL morals I am a hardcore Libertarian when it comes to individual freedom. It's a slippery slope when government starts creating laws governing the moral actions of a free people.
There's a moral hypocrisy within the majority of anti-gay marriage activists. Cheating on a spouse is immoral, but I don't hear anything about the anti-gay marriage crowd protesting at a cheaters home. Gluttony is also considered by many to be immoral, again there aren't any protests outside an over eating gluttons home. It's because of a moral hypocrisy.
More often then not the anti-gay marriage crowd base their beliefs off of religion. There's absolutely nothing wrong with having a moral code that tell you that gay marriage is wrong, but what is wrong is when you try to force your moral code on the rest of society.
I have a question for anyone who wants to create laws to dictate a moral code such as limiting marriage to man and woman. If we as a people don't have the freedom and choice to live our own moral code, and our actions and morality is dictated through government as opposed to personal convictions and faith, what purpose would there then be for religion?
God doesn't make us live a certain way. God may require it, but the choice is ours. If God gave us choice, what gives us the right to limit another's choice?
I admire your belief in everyone having the right to their individual freedoms even if they use that for something you think is wrong, but I am curious, why do you think homosexuality is wrong? I won't jump on you, I'm just curious
Personally I would prefer a civil partnership anyway because of the religious connotations of 'marriage' but I like the fact that other people will have this opportunity.
'Never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you.'
['There is only one thing we say to death. Not today'.']
'We are each our own devil, and we make this world our hell. Oscar Wilde
Its hard to dance with the devil on your back. Sydney Carter
I admire your belief in everyone having the right to their individual freedoms even if they use that for something you think is wrong, but I am curious, why do you think homosexuality is wrong? I won't jump on you, I'm just curious
Personally I would prefer a civil partnership anyway because of the religious connotations of 'marriage' but I like the fact that other people will have this opportunity.
Even at the age of 16 I realize no answer I give will be acceptable to all and will likely hurt feelings. I will simply say it is a PERSONAL belief that centers around marriage's original intent of being a religious institution. Although I disagree with same sex marriage I still desire no laws restricting it, but I too am more comfortable with the idea of civil marriages because of the removal of the religious aspect of it.
That's as in depth as I am willing to venture into a debate of this often emotional argument on a forum like this one.
Personally I would prefer a civil partnership anyway because of the religious connotations of 'marriage' but I like the fact that other people will have this opportunity.
Even at the age of 16 I realize no answer I give will be acceptable to all and will likely hurt feelings. I will simply say it is a PERSONAL belief that centers around marriage's original intent of being a religious institution. Although I disagree with same sex marriage I still desire no laws restricting it, but I too am more comfortable with the idea of civil marriages because of the removal of the religious aspect of it.
That's as in depth as I am willing to venture into a debate of this often emotional argument on a forum like this one.
I respect that but I do find it interesting that you hold such a view, are willing to mention it, but not substantiate it with any sort of evidence.
'Never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you.'
['There is only one thing we say to death. Not today'.']
'We are each our own devil, and we make this world our hell. Oscar Wilde
Its hard to dance with the devil on your back. Sydney Carter
I never really "got" the whole civil partnership thing. Differentiating civil partnership & marriage calls the true definition of marriage into question.
If "getting married" & "entering a civil partnership" has the same legal implications, for instance, why change the name? It's just highlighting something that... doesn't need to be highlighted? People who are athiests & get married in a registry office rather than a church because they don't like churches are still recognized as being "married" rather than a "civil partnership", so it can't be a religious thing. Idk.
Brilliant :D I hate to say it, but this is the most decent thing the coalition have done in their time in office. Methinks some of the traditionalist back benchers (and some of the traditionalist cabinet members too) won't like it, but I think the majority of MPs are for same-sex marriage. It gives me hope for politics when I hear a thing like this :P
I respect that but I do find it interesting that you hold such a view, are willing to mention it, but not substantiate it with any sort of evidence.
I didn't say I was unwilling, I said this type of forum isn't the place. Besides a personal belief is just that a personal belief. No one has to show validity to their personal belief, their only obligation is to allow others to have their own personal beliefs.
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I do find it interesting that you hold such a view, are willing to mention it, but not substantiate it with any sort of evidence.
This is exactly the kind of attitude I mentioned at the beginning of my original post.
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I think far too many people feel so compelled to cause everyone to believe the same way they do that they misunderstand or ignore what freedom is.
Freedom isn't only in ones actions but their beliefs.
Because I was unwilling to discuss the details of why I have that personal belief you undoubtedly feel let down, maybe vindicated, I don't know. I know for sure that no answer I gave would be good enough. I refuse to be goated into further discussion of this matter on here so that you can attempt to prove your moral or intellectual dominance over a 16 year old girl and in the process possibly cause emotional distress to others who struggle with their own personal beliefs and/or orientation.
I don't think Katy was trying to prove any type of dominance over you. I think she was just simply wondering what your reasoning is for viewing a certain type of sexual orientation as being 'wrong'. Which is valid, considering you're the one who brought it up.
And, it would be okay to talk about it on this forum, due to it being the news and debate forum. We've had other threads, like this one, that have the ability to be upsetting and most people are fine with it. People will usually try to separate themselves from the thread if they find it upsetting.
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Either way, I think this fantastic for the people who want to be married to their partner!
Yeah, if you make big bold statements like that you do need to be prepared to defend them. Because people will be offended by your beliefs, and they will have the right to challenge you on them. Especially on a board like this.
Anyway:
Quote:
Good, and to those who moan about it... if you don't like it don't get one. Stop being a bunch of nosey curtain twitchers.
Yeah, if you make big bold statements like that you do need to be prepared to defend them. Because people will be offended by your beliefs, and they will have the right to challenge you on them. Especially on a board like this.
Anyway:
QTF.
The sad part is no one really read what I wrote. I never said being gay was wrong. I said I feel that it is wrong. There's a far cry difference between an opinion that I expressed and a proven fact. I never once claimed it to be a fact. Further why should my opinion of if being gay it right or wrong offend anyone. I'm not offended because people think there's nothing wrong with being gay. This all goes back to my original point that too many people feel compelled to convince everyone to believe the same way they do.
The religious right have a moral code driven by religion that tells them being gay is wrong and the vast majority of them seek to use the power of the government to control the rights of people because of their sense of moral code. Many on the opposite end of the spectrum feel nothing is wrong with it and want to use government pass laws defining a marriage in there favor. All I said was government has no right to get involved.
Regardless of what my beliefs on the matter is I DO NOT WANT LAWS PASSED RESTRICTING MARRIAGE EVEN IF IT IS A SAME SEX MARRIAGE. The really sad part is neither side wants compromise. Both sides want all or nothing.
As far as backing up my personal beliefs, it can't be done, hence the whole idea of a personal belief. Only factual things can be backed up and I made no factual statement, I simply expressed an opinion.
I refuse to be goated into further discussion of this matter on here so that you can attempt to prove your moral or intellectual dominance over a 16 year old girl and in the process possibly cause emotional distress to others who struggle with their own personal beliefs and/or orientation.
Okay I really do think you are taking this far too personally. I have no desire or need to 'prove dominance' over you and I don't think your age has anything to do with this whatsoever, I'm only two years older than you myself, age doesn't come into it.
But yes, I respect your decision to not expand on why you hold this 'personal belief' I was just commenting on the fact that I found it interesting that you weren't willing to explain it, see Interesting, not a criticism, I was just asking. It is news and debate forum after all.
However what I will say is that I Very much respect you for the fact that despite your 'personal beliefs' you don't want those beliefs to take away the rights of others so yes.
'Never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you.'
['There is only one thing we say to death. Not today'.']
'We are each our own devil, and we make this world our hell. Oscar Wilde
Its hard to dance with the devil on your back. Sydney Carter
I think personal belief is fine. But refusal to consider that your personal belief is wrong, especially when you have no evidence your personal belief is right, is under the definition of the word 'ignorance' is it not?
If I have an opinion that X is blue, and other people think that X is green, it's is my personal belief that X is blue, but unless I can provide evidence that supports why I think that, I have to acknowledge that I may be wrong.
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